[HBL] Tornadium - Permaban

[Tornadium]

Byond account and character name: Tornadium - Osborn Auman
Banning admin: HBL
Ban type (What are you banned from?): All Servers
Ban reason and length: Permanent, Can't seem to get byond to work at the moment. The long and short of the reason was that he doesn't think warnings, temporary bans or job bans will work with me ever because I turn everything into an argument so I should go look at other servers (That's roughly what the message was, if someone can retrieve the actual message that'd be appreciated).
Time ban was placed (including time zone): 31/07/15 (Not sure what time it was placed as I wasn't online)
Your side of the story: Not much to say, I have spoken to HBL in IRC after I noticed I got banned after the Silicon issue and he said he would like me to make an appeal to see what people thought. I told him I didn't want to lie in the appeal so I won't. I still don't understand the perspective of what was being enforced. Obviously I accept what was decided by the admin (I didn't escalate the issue, I didn't go to a headmin, I didn't make any other thread or kick up a fuss beyond talking in the appeal thread and PMing the admin to try to come to an understanding on the rules so I wouldn't repeat the behavior) and obviously the ban was placed based on the decision that nothing would get through to me. That was somewhat untrue as I said before I just accepted it in the end. A large portion of the admins already wanted me rule 0 banned so I understand where the ban came from and I'll say if they have a legitimate problem then I'm not in a position to say their decision is wrong. Clearly I have done enough to upset a large number of people and I'll throw my hands up and say I've fucked up by doing so.

That said I what was explained still doesn't click with me and I said as much in IRC, I don't want to feed you shit and pretend that I understand the decision I was given when I straight up don't. It doesn't show you any respect and it doesn't show that I'm sincere to bullshit you and lie through my teeth for the sake of getting unbanned.

Why you think you should be unbanned: Not much I can say again beyond I'll just progressively try to improve my playstyle, attempt to communicate with people to understand the current enforcement policy and not appeal any decision made against me and just accept the decision the admins make.

[Hibbles]

I'm gonna do a thing here, and welcome anybody to step forward with what they think. As long as it's not a straight-up shitpost or 'he a faget', then I want to hear what you, yes, you think about Tornadium and whether he should be out, or whether he should be in. Posts, even ones normally that would get removed, won't in here. This is not about a specific incident. This is about him as a player, hence le Rule Zero Perma.

Also it goes without saying but the headmins are welcome to handle this if they think it's needed.

[Falamazeer]

I like that instead of a flimsy ill advised ban you decided to man up and just call it what it is.
A well earned Rule 0 ban. so good on you hibbles

Everything tornadium touches turns to pure liquid shit spewing down the proverbial thighs of the forum. It's multi-page threads of him furiously masturbating while typing up his next epic response in the battle for the ages. Tornadium against the world in a never-ending clusterfuck of posts and counterposts. and he's reportedly worse on IRC over the same damn things. Which makes sense because he already treats the forum like live chats.

[Tornadium]

I like that instead of a flimsy ill advised ban you decided to man up and just call it what it is.
A well earned Rule 0 ban. so good on you hibbles

Everything tornadium touches turns to pure liquid shit spewing down the proverbial thighs of the forum. It's multi-page threads of him furiously masturbating while typing up his next epic response in the battle for the ages. Tornadium against the world in a never-ending clusterfuck of posts and counterposts. and he's reportedly worse on IRC over the same damn things. Which makes sense because he already treats the forum like live chats.

I assure you the forums are worse than IRC.

[Vekter]

Tornadium has had a long standing history of being one of the black sheeps among the players. I remember him getting so bad about raising Cain over his bans that some of us refused to even handle his ahelps, because we knew 99% of the time, it was something he caused.

I'm not at home, but can someone post his notes on here?

[Tornadium]

Tornadium has had a long standing history of being one of the black sheeps among the players. I remember him getting so bad about raising Cain over his bans that some of us refused to even handle his ahelps, because we knew 99% of the time, it was something he caused.

I'm not at home, but can someone post his notes on here?

12-Jun-2013 | Banned - Accidental bombing- reduced ban 2 hours for honesty and coming to us first. ~hbk2006 [-]
13-Oct-2013 | Banned for 30 minutes - Released the singularity, accidental or not. ~giacomand [-]
19-Jun-2015 | As RD, crit someone for breaking into EVA. ~lollerderby [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Asshole from years ago. Don't take any of his crap and ban him if he starts giving you shit. ~ikarrus [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Warned - Permabrigging someone for inconveniencing him ~ikarrus [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Banned from Head of Security, Warden, Detective, Security Officer - Permabrigged someone for seemingly inconveniencing him, threw a tanrum and suicided. ~ikarrus [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Banned from Captain - Permabrigged someone for seemingly inconveniencing him, threw a tanrum and suicided. ~ikarrus [-]
22-Jun-2015 | If he refuses to answer admin PMs again/complains afterward I'm banning him for a long time ~korphaeron [-]
29-Jun-2015 | As SO - Used paper-thin reasoning (and what I suspect to be outright lies) to justify executing a Mime with the blob; later perma-brigging that Mime when told they obviously couldn't do this. Argued for days, referencing the parts of Space Law that justify him and ignoring or dismissing those that don't. ~subtlegraces [-]
29-Jun-2015 | (Also will appeal to a Headmin regardless of the situation, be ready to argue on IRC) ~subtlegraces [-]
15-Jul-2015 | Has been acting quite shitty as security lately to the point where people are bringing it up in deadchat consistently. ~quartzcrystal [-]
22-Jul-2015 | Found 3 tators in 1 round using flimsy reasoning for arrests and searches. Offically suspected of metagaming or metacomming or some sort of fuckary that involves ghosts. ~mrstonedone [-]
22-Jul-2015 | Banned from Head of Security, Warden, Detective, Security Officer - You take security way too seriously. Executing prisoners without chain of command, metagaming possible traitor items, and just all around being shitcurity at its finest. Appeal this when you've learned to play the game without a "Gotta Win At Space!" attitude. ~saegrimr [-]

HBL Advised me not to reply but I guess this isn't argumentative. Just context.

These are my notes as of a previous thread (I think there are another two, one for the silicon situation and one for the perma).

As of the 13 notes two were in 2013 and opposite ends of the year, 5 are related to one incident that was solved after a chat in IRC. The rest were two other incidents that were lifted after appeal.

All occurred in the last two months.

Not sure where the long standing thing comes from.

[Arete]

He doesn't seem to understand that if he makes the game less fun for everyone else, they aren't going to want to play with him.

[Vekter]

He doesn't seem to understand that if he makes the game less fun for everyone else, they aren't going to want to play with him.

This seems to be the primary complaint.

[Screemonster]

He doesn't seem to understand that if he makes the game less fun for everyone else, they aren't going to want to play with him.

that's the message I took away from the silicon ban thread.

There was a lot of arguing about the exact letter of the rules and the AI law and blah blah blah, but very little thought given to the overall "hmm, lots of people all seem to be agreed that regardless of the exact letter of the law, it was a generally shitty thing to do"

I'm reminded of someone on another forum I'm on that mentioned how they'd been pushed out of other communities by "admin conspiracies" and so on - when several people, or groups of people, all independently come to the same conclusion, even people who'd never met each other or communicated with each other before, then maybe, just maybe, they're onto something.

This is fixable, but Very Aggressive Crab essentially sums it up - before it's possible to fix, you gotta take personal responsibility, look at the one common factor in every argument or shitstorm you're ever involved in - yourself.

[Tornadium]

I concede that.

I'll throw my hands up and say that I accept I was wrong because everyone thinks I was wrong.

I do have "that" kind of personality though and I've admitted as much on IRC when having a chat with people. If for example I perceive something against me to be unjust then I usually do over react, especially if I have experienced someone doing something I consider to be much worse and not receiving any punishment.

It's a problem, I acknowledge that.

[Vekter]

I concede that.

I'll throw my hands up and say that I accept I was wrong because everyone thinks I was wrong.

I do have "that" kind of personality though and I've admitted as much on IRC when having a chat with people. If for example I perceive something against me to be unjust then I usually do over react, especially if I have experienced someone doing something I consider to be much worse and not receiving any punishment.

It's a problem, I acknowledge that.

That's a level of self-awareness I didn't expect from you.

I'd have no objection to a probationary term.

[Tornadium]

Thanks for the endorsement.

[ThanatosRa]

I am concerned because as a heavy forum user (I barely play anymore, I just hang around the forum because I like you people for some ungodly reason), All I see from Tornadium is arguments, negativity and shitstirring.(Don't ask me for a list of examples, I'm at work.) You're a Muckraker and a brigand... though not on the top of the list I'd Rule Zero ban(though you're on it, and no I'm not putting it up). Regardless, with my experience as a regular FNR reader I am concerned that your self awareness is feigned, or just a ploy to get another chance, lay low for awhile, and then return to your shit ways when you're off the radar again. This has much precedent in our community. Still, there is a possibility, with the way you've presented yourself thus far, that you are being sincere. If that is so, forgive my cynicism. I would side with Vekter in that regard.

[Vekter]

If HBL would have it, I'd be more than willing to write up a terms of probation and keep an eye on him. It would have to be strict given the circumstances.

[onleavedontatme]

I am concerned because as a heavy forum user (I barely play anymore, I just hang around the forum because I like you people for some ungodly reason), All I see from Tornadium is arguments, negativity and shitstirring.(Don't ask me for a list of examples, I'm at work.) You're a Muckraker and a brigand... though not on the top of the list I'd Rule Zero ban(though you're on it, and no I'm not putting it up). Regardless, with my experience as a regular FNR reader I am concerned that your self awareness is feigned, or just a ploy to get another chance, lay low for awhile, and then return to your shit ways when you're off the radar again. This has much precedent in our community. Still, there is a possibility, with the way you've presented yourself thus far, that you are being sincere. If that is so, forgive my cynicism. I would side with Vekter in that regard.

To his credit he didn't shit up IRC during/after the borg ban, and he hasn't done it so far during this ban, nor has he made a dozen threads, so I think he genuinely is trying to keep things under control.

That said the admin team is pissed at me for lifting your bans over and over so I'm gonna leave this one to HBL and Vekter.

If it doesn't work out now you might have better luck in a couple months when your arguments aren't so fresh in adminbus's memory.

[Vekter]

To his credit he didn't shit up IRC during/after the borg ban, and he hasn't done it so far during this ban, nor has he made a dozen threads, so I think he genuinely is trying to keep things under control.

This is the only reason I think this should even be considered.

[ThanatosRa]

To his credit he didn't shit up IRC during/after the borg ban, and he hasn't done it so far during this ban, nor has he made a dozen threads, so I think he genuinely is trying to keep things under control.

This is the only reason I think this should even be considered.

Seems like a valid "whoa, what the fuck have I done" moment. Sure. You have my foolish plebeian support. Do no betray my trust Tornadium.

[Tornadium]

Thank you I appreciate that.

If I was lying I'd probably have bullshitted a lot in my OP. I told the guys in IRC and in the OP that I still don't quite understand the cyborg issue (my understanding of the rules etc etc). I'm letting it go and just accepting that it was a dick thing to do because everyone considers it to be a dick thing to do.

I'd rather not be one of those people who bullshit through their teeth about suddenly coming to a glorious epiphany and suddenly not be a shithead anymore.

I'll try to improve and obviously abide by any probation terms.

[Fr05tByt3]

To his credit he didn't shit up IRC during/after the borg ban, and he hasn't done it so far during this ban, nor has he made a dozen threads, so I think he genuinely is trying to keep things under control.

This is the only reason I think this should even be considered.

Seems like a valid "whoa, what the fuck have I done" moment. Sure. You have my foolish plebeian support. Do no betray my trust Tornadium.

This.
We all stir up the shitpot sometimes. Some more than others. Meh, it keeps the badmins on their toes.

I will say this, though; the probationary terms need to be very simple and concrete. I.e IF YOU DO X THEN Y WILL DEFINITELY HAPPEN. So he can't try to argue his way out of it or blame anyone else if he fucks up again. You can literally win that argument by copypasta-ing the agreement terms.
Not that you couldn't just ban him anyway, but this way no one can say WOOOOOOW WHAT A DICKFACE BADMIN BANNING POOR TORNADIUM HE DINDU NUFFIN.

[Tornadium]

To his credit he didn't shit up IRC during/after the borg ban, and he hasn't done it so far during this ban, nor has he made a dozen threads, so I think he genuinely is trying to keep things under control.

This is the only reason I think this should even be considered.

Seems like a valid "whoa, what the fuck have I done" moment. Sure. You have my foolish plebeian support. Do no betray my trust Tornadium.

This.
We all stir up the shitpot sometimes. Some more than others. Meh, it keeps the badmins on their toes.

I will say this, though; the probationary terms need to be very simple and concrete. I.e IF YOU DO X THEN Y WILL DEFINITELY HAPPEN. So he can't try to argue his way out of it or blame anyone else if he fucks up again. You can literally win that argument by copypasta-ing the agreement terms.
Not that you couldn't just ban him anyway, but this way no one can say WOOOOOOW WHAT A DICKFACE BADMIN BANNING POOR TORNADIUM HE DINDU NUFFIN.

I would prefer this.

[Akkryls]

Considering his last ban before the Cyborg incident he was banned from IRC before he even got on there, I kind of understand where he was coming from with arguing so much on the forums. I'd probably argue half to death as well.
Why is there such an issue with people contesting bans which aren't entirely black and white? There's a world of difference from GreyshirtMcShitface bombing medbay and then logging compared to stuff like this (https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=4232).
Dealing with people based entirely on past notes is kind of shitty too; from his notes that Saegrimr posted in the other thread, that four of them seem to be from the same incident with Ikkarus. Stuff like this basically makes it seem like he has a HUGE history of being shit, but it's a bunch of notes about the same incidents.

Spoiler:

12-Jun-2013 | Banned - Accidental bombing- reduced ban 2 hours for honesty and coming to us first. ~hbk2006 [-]
13-Oct-2013 | Banned for 30 minutes - Released the singularity, accidental or not. ~giacomand [-]
19-Jun-2015 | As RD, crit someone for breaking into EVA. ~lollerderby [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Asshole from years ago. Don't take any of his crap and ban him if he starts giving you shit. ~ikarrus [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Warned - Permabrigging someone for inconveniencing him ~ikarrus [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Banned from Head of Security, Warden, Detective, Security Officer - Permabrigged someone for seemingly inconveniencing him, threw a tanrum and suicided. ~ikarrus [-]
21-Jun-2015 | Banned from Captain - Permabrigged someone for seemingly inconveniencing him, threw a tanrum and suicided. ~ikarrus [-]
22-Jun-2015 | If he refuses to answer admin PMs again/complains afterward I'm banning him for a long time ~korphaeron [-]
29-Jun-2015 | As SO - Used paper-thin reasoning (and what I suspect to be outright lies) to justify executing a Mime with the blob; later perma-brigging that Mime when told they obviously couldn't do this. Argued for days, referencing the parts of Space Law that justify him and ignoring or dismissing those that don't. ~subtlegraces [-]
29-Jun-2015 | (Also will appeal to a Headmin regardless of the situation, be ready to argue on IRC) ~subtlegraces [-]
15-Jul-2015 | Has been acting quite shitty as security lately to the point where people are bringing it up in deadchat consistently. ~quartzcrystal [-]
22-Jul-2015 | Found 3 tators in 1 round using flimsy reasoning for arrests and searches. Offically suspected of metagaming or metacomming or some sort of fuckary that involves ghosts. ~mrstonedone [-]
22-Jul-2015 | Banned from Head of Security, Warden, Detective, Security Officer - You take security way too seriously. Executing prisoners without chain of command, metagaming possible traitor items, and just all around being shitcurity at its finest. Appeal this when you've learned to play the game without a "Gotta Win At Space!" attitude. ~saegrimr [-]

The meson thing is pretty iffy but otherwise it doesn't sound like a great ban. Nothing else was against the rules if it happened the way you said it did. Half your notes are just "I don't really like this" guy as well.

Is he an asshole? Probably.
I just feel it's incredibly shitty to be throwing the book at him under the reasoning that "You've got this history of making questionable judgements as security, and arguing with admins". Hell, just apply sec bans / probation and let him play if you don't want to deal with the complaints. If the bans were actually reasonable in the first place then he wouldn't be arguing so much and Kor wouldn't have to keep lifting them because he thinks they're bad.

I also think he was in the right in regards to the cyborg incident, but I suppose that's a moot point now.

[Scott]

I think this is trivializing permanent banning. Half of his notes are Security related, just keep him banned from Security.

[Tornadium]

I think this is trivializing permanent banning. Half of his notes are Security related, just keep him banned from Security.

In my defense

Five notes were related to one incident, my conduct was actually fine. Everyone agreed that what I did in terms of the security based decision was cool, it was my unwillingness to communicate with Ikarrus was the issue there. The ban on the 22nd had two notes, one was suspected of metagaming because I got semi-lucky and caught dudes (well, if you consider someone shouting out over the radio lucky as well as actually having valid concerns to search someone)and the security ban was lifted (It was established that it really was just a rule 0 ban, not a security ban).

The mime thing that's up for debate I guess.

[Vekter]

I think this is trivializing permanent banning. Half of his notes are Security related, just keep him banned from Security.

His perma has less to do with his in-game conduct and more how he handles himself when interacting with admins.

[Scott]

So you want to ban him from the game for being a nuisance OOC instead of just telling him to quit being a nuisance.

That sounds mature.

[Vekter]

So you want to ban him from the game for being a nuisance OOC instead of just telling him to quit being a nuisance.

That sounds mature.

We've told him. He's had his chances. The only reason we're considering unbanning him this time is he's managed to actually listen for once.

[rdght91]

IMHO I don't think you should permaban anyone who actually appears to be making a good faith effort to change, even if they're going to have a few bumps along the way. A few days or a week to cool off and get some perspective seems more appropriate when they have those "bumps".

[Ahammer18]

The issue is that these 'bumps' keep happening. At what point do you throw in the towel and say that they aren't worth it anymore?

[Scott]

I only see four recent incidents in his notes and they're all Security related, you can just keep him banned from Sec.

But you're right ahammer, lets permaban him for that, he's totally on the same level of the people who are permabanned right now.

[Fr05tByt3]

Rule 0 is pretty simple, honestly.
Don't be a dick.
Tornadium, if you do get unbanned, stop validhunting.
Sec isn't validhunters. Sec is to protect the station and the crew. If someone has a pair of mesons... oh well. Who cares? Your valids are not more important than someone else's fun.
Ever.
Valids don't even necessarily = your fun.
Don't play the game to fucking win. That ruins the experience for everyone, INCLUDING YOURSELF. It's so much more fun to loosen up a bit and let things play out in different ways at different times, rather than trying to do your best to ruin the fun for everyone by WINNING TEH GAEM. If that means you die once in a while when you could have lived if you had gone full validhunter and smashed someone's face as soon as you felt suspicious, then so what? Dying isn't that bad. Maybe cry about it in deadchat a bit and watch some terribly written ERP.

[Tornadium]

Again in my defense the first incident my Sec conduct was absolutely fine, it was my OOC conduct.

The last incident was overruled because the ban wasn't really based on anything other than rule 0, The mesons thing was proven to be a lie (Scones had said I took them off immediately and checked them, when in reality I didn't touch his mesons during that round) in the logs and the metacomm note wasn't really based on anything (As of the 3 traitors, one was caught by virtue of getting lucky and being there along with others at the right time while the second was some dude screaming that he was getting shot and the third was Scones acting shifty as fuck.

Not denying my OOC conduct wasn't great but I wasn't really "valid hunting".

[Tornadium]

Just to check what are the probation terms?

[Hibbles]

I dunno. I've said it before but I'll say it again just to clarify; the Headmins are welcome to come and handle this as they see fit. I'm not prepared to lift it myself, but I'd like this thread to remain open until like, nobody else has stuff to say, or shitposts begin.

That's not an invitation.

[Tornadium]

So I need to get a headmin to lift this?

What's the point of asking me to make an appeal thread then.

[Tornadium]

Just remembered Kor already said he was leaving it to you so appeal denied I guess?

[Malkevin]

Okay.

I'm going to be brutally honest here.
Every single thread I've seen about Tornadium (with the exception of this recent borg thing, which I haven't seen - link/details pls) has been absolutely retarded.
Not on Tornadium's part but on the part of every single admin except for Kor.

So now you're Rule Zeroing him out of the game permanently because, instead of him rolling rolling over and taking it up the arse, he defended himself.

Are you kidding me?
Are you fucking kidding me???

Seriously, you guys need to collectively pull your heads out your arses and think on that for a moment.
Are you honestly blaming Tornadium for complaining so much on IRC when there is an actual real hate boner against him from the administration?


I legitimately, honestly feel bad for the guy.
I mean Tornadium's been around for as long as I have, and he's never had any beyond minor complaints against him until this thing a few months back with Ikarrus (who outright admitted to being biased against him) and everything in this perma ban has spiraled on from that - and its all because of what? Because he argued with you guys for a few hours in IRC over a shitty ban?

I really can't grasp how it can be such an alien concept to you people that when you've been wronged you fight back.



TL/DR - just ban him from IRC and tell him to follow the same FNR process as every other chump that plays this game.

[callanrockslol]

Tornadium hasn't actually done anything worth a permaban, silicon ban yes forever please and a sec ban definitely wouldn't hurt.

I really can't grasp how it can be such an alien concept to you people that when you've been wronged you fight back

Admins have too much power again, need a strong headministration to keep them in line and purge the unworthy. Kidding.

[Falamazeer]

Excellent points

But dude, I've defended myself aggressively since forever, I've called the last two hosts into question, loudly, twice each.
I've shit on two out of the three current headmins across multiple threads, I've been less than respectful in a few of my admin helps with the third (sorry kor) and I loudly hate two of the fullmins.

On the surface, me and tornadium have similar histories, the biggest difference? That thin little line of restraint between being contrary for contrary's sake. and just being opinionated.

Nobody bullies me, I've never felt the grasp of the adminspiracy, and I'm fully capable of blending back in with the hoarde, tornadium sticks out like a sore thumb because he just KEEPS GOING.

But then again, he is showing a lot of restraint here, and a willingness to clean up his act, so I say we just move on, and see if he can keep his shit together long enough for people to forget he was a pain in the dick once.

I still haven't seen a new pap storm, so maybe douchers can be fixed, now if only someone would work on the terbs case again.

[Tornadium]

Tornadium hasn't actually done anything worth a permaban, silicon ban yes forever please and a sec ban definitely wouldn't hurt.

Have I actually done anything worth a sec ban?

Silicon maybe after the last incident, I'd disagree with it but I'm hardly in a position to say no.

It's starting to blur the line here as to what this is ban is based on, was it my conduct OOC in appealing bans and dealing with admins or was it based on ingame player conduct?

[Shadowlight213]

I think sec ban is being brought up due to most of the issues popping up when you play sec.

[Tornadium]

I think sec ban is being brought up due to most of the issues popping up when you play sec.

I think 3 issues have notes that were sec related, the first one was just bad notes. My security conduct was fine (admins agreed) it was just me not wanting to deal with Ikarrus.

The second was somewhat debatable, Down to personal interpretation.

The third after appeal was lifted because it really was just a rule 0 ban (as admitted during that thread) as my conduct that round again was fine.

People seem to have this view that I valid hunt, I really don't see where that is coming from.

[Tornadium]

Anyone want to make a stab at that?

[Actionb]

You wanted ingame impressions of Tornadium's character?
From what I remember when encountering Osman, he always came across like a huge power tripper.
Ranging from starting a mutiny because the captain overruled him as an officer, to locking down a cyborg during a blob round for not following a dumb law 2 order while it had something better to do. 'Muh authoritah' players like that are cancer to security.

[Tornadium]

You wanted ingame impressions of Tornadium's character?
From what I remember when encountering Osman, he always came across like a huge power tripper.
Ranging from starting a mutiny because the captain overruled him as an officer, to locking down a cyborg during a blob round for not following a dumb law 2 order while it had something better to do. 'Muh authoritah' players like that are cancer to security.

The Mutiny was around the Captain wanting to release two confirmed Antagonists.

I don't think it makes me a power tripper to not want to give those two another free attempt and end up dead from a bomb or in maint somewhere.

Which cyborg thing are you referring to?

Though if it's a non-conflicting Law 2 order the borg really should be following his laws.

[Actionb]

I'm gonna do a thing here, and welcome anybody to step forward with what they think.

I have given my opinion about Tornadium. Nothing more, nothing less.
The exact details of particular events do not matter. For one, they are mere pixels that form a greater picture.
And secondly, I know, you would try to come up with a justification for your actions - oddly enough, I just wish you were this calm and calculating when playing the game.

[Tornadium]

I'm gonna do a thing here, and welcome anybody to step forward with what they think.

I have given my opinion about Tornadium. Nothing more, nothing less.
The exact details of particular events do not matter. For one, they are mere pixels that form a greater picture.
And secondly, I know, you would try to come up with a justification for your actions - oddly enough, I just wish you were this calm and calculating when playing the game.

I would disagree, Misrepresentation of events leads to a spiral situation of negative opinion.

I could say "Torn kills people every round as security" but the context is that the kills are done in combat against Antagonists. You can't really just throw out an accusation then not provide context for me to be able to defend my actions then judge me for it.

Also is this appeal denied or?

[Tornadium]

Bumping, Hopped into IRC couldn't get a hold of a headmin or hibbles the last two nights.

[Falamazeer]

It kinda lends validity to the over aggressive posting and IRC harassment tornadium was known for when he can't get a solid answer without it.

He's in a bit of a pickle because he doesn't want to raise a shit storm to ask, but actually he's been asking for 6 days, just scroll up and see.

[Hibbles]

Yep, I've been waffling a lot on this. Hence this thread at all. I wanted to see whether Tornadium would do the Phoenix Wright villanous breakdown like Kavaloosh, or what people thought in general.

Okay, I'm going to reduce the serverban to a month, which is still a long dang time. But during this time I'd strongly suggest literally not playing any SS13. At all. Go find something else to do. If you want to come back in a month, well. I know a few sizable breaks from this game did wonders for me.

I'm going to put on a perma secban as well if you do decide to return, you can appeal that after you're back playing and it's established you're doing alright. As for you right now, you're not the type of person we want playing Security. Or on the server at all, hence the perma, but Hell.

Either you get better or the other thing happens, and either way it's no longer our problem. I'm pretty sure you know I won't sit by if your behavior just restarts, and since I'm literally the only admin on the case, yeah.

[Tornadium]

Yep, I've been waffling a lot on this. Hence this thread at all. I wanted to see whether Tornadium would do the Phoenix Wright villanous breakdown like Kavaloosh, or what people thought in general.

Okay, I'm going to reduce the serverban to a month, which is still a long dang time. But during this time I'd strongly suggest literally not playing any SS13. At all. Go find something else to do. If you want to come back in a month, well. I know a few sizable breaks from this game did wonders for me.

I'm going to put on a perma secban as well if you do decide to return, you can appeal that after you're back playing and it's established you're doing alright. As for you right now, you're not the type of person we want playing Security. Or on the server at all, hence the perma, but Hell.

Either you get better or the other thing happens, and either way it's no longer our problem. I'm pretty sure you know I won't sit by if your behavior just restarts, and since I'm literally the only admin on the case, yeah.

I'm not sure I quite understand, Why am I getting a perma sec banned if every single note I have regarding security was deemed to be shitty and overturned?

You're acting like reducing it to a month is generous, I'm not going to lie to you hell I'm actually very surprised. I didn't deserve a perma or a month ban from the server based on my playstyle I feel, At least in the context of what other people have received for significantly worse conduct. I think is should also be considered in the context of the length of time I've been around without incident.

Can you at least elaborate as to why you don't want me playing as security or on the server at all? I'm not going to learn anything without some kind of guidance. I'd like to hear what members of the community think regarding what you would suggest to become a player that you want on the server. From what I'm seeing at least from a few policy threads and the threads in the general forums there are a lot of people who are disgruntled with the handling of issues similar to my own. Hell the last Security issue I had was called out as being straight up retarded and if you take into account the whole "executiing without authorization" rule getting changed there wasn't a single thing about my conduct that was debatable (hell scones was even lying about events in an attempt to get me banned).