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Peanut thread for: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=32753
Funny you mention this because I made an application earlier today. Highly doubt it will be accepted, as I don't have enough recent playtime and I'm sort of a controversial figure. But it never hurts to try right?
This part is actually pretty gross. Dude knew what they were doing, the reported issue existed, and they continued to do it or wanted to do it.Archie700 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 1:23 amAh, with that context, I could say you made the decision to allow Seth to do that in good faith.Scriptis wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 1:10 amI'm not omnipresent. This is the first time I've seen this contraption in actual action, the round previous had a 210 (!!)-condenser chain that got somebody into hot shit by another admin. Even then, I was having dinner and was idle for most of the round.
Judging by the fact that he had the thing in a holofirelock box in a secluded corner of the station (ordnance), it's reasonable to assume it was to test its efficacy for cooling.Scriptis, did you ask Seth why he wanted to do the condenser chain? Did you know they caused lag before that?
I personally have tried using bulk condensers to cool the supermatter engine. It's not the dumbest thing I've seen, and I encourage players to push the game's systems to their limits--as long as it's not hurting anybody, like the grief it caused the round prior. In this case, it didn't look like it was an issue.
I didn't know anything about what else he had done prior other than somebody getting bopped over it, but the condenser chain this round wasn't nearly as impactful (or laggy) as the one prior.
The problem was that Seth was trying to do something that caused lag, though with fewer condensers, and I believe the lag was client-side due to having to load so much, so it wouldn't have been notice on the server itself.
There's also the assertion that he did it multiple rounds with lag, but I don't have the details.
EDIT: So I looked into last round and it turns out Seth knew about the 200-condenser monstrosity and logs implied he MADE IT.
https://scrubby.melonmesa.com/round/194 ... e=game.txt
Code: Select all
03:34:34 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "lkucy" (96, 105, 2) Medbay Central 03:34:35 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "lucy" (96, 105, 2) Medbay Central 03:34:37 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "OH YM GOD" (96, 105, 2) Medbay Central 03:34:38 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "LUCY" (96, 105, 2) Medbay Central 03:34:41 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "CHECK" (89, 103, 2) Medbay Central 03:34:42 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "THS PUT" (89, 103, 2) Medbay Central 03:35:26 EMOTE Hoolny/(Seth Deces) screams! (88, 89, 2) Medbay Central 03:35:27 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "i did it" (88, 89, 2) Medbay Central 03:35:55 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "THE ULTIAMTE MACHIEN IS MINE" (92, 79, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:02 EMOTE Hoolny/(Seth Deces) gasps! (95, 80, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:29 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "i did it" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:31 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "teh ultimate" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:32 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "machine" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:32 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "is so" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:33 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "funny" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:34 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "ahahah" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:34 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "haahah" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:37 WHISPER Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "IM SO" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:38 WHISPER Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "PROUD" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:39 WHISPER Hoolny/(Seth Deces) "OF MYSELF" (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:47 EMOTE Hoolny/(Seth Deces) seizes up and falls limp, their eyes dead and lifeless... (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:48 ACCESS Mob Login: Hoolny/(Seth Deces) was assigned to a /mob/dead/observer 03:36:48 GAME Hoolny/(Seth Deces) Client Hoolny/(Seth Deces) has taken ownership of mob Seth Deces(/mob/dead/observer) (89, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:51 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "HAAHAH" (90, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:36:52 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "AHAHAH" (90, 81, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:43 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "I MADE" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:44 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "IT" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:46 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "ITS BEAUTIFUL" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:51 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "I made that" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:52 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "im so proud" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:53 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "of ymself" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:54 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "no" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:56 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "its not 20" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:56 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "its" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:57 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "250" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:59 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "consumers" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:37:59 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "together" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:38:02 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "or more" (90, 98, 2) Medbay Central 03:38:04 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "yep"Code: Select all
SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "does the machine" (126, 159, 2) Fore Maintenance 03:42:40 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "only lag the area around you right" (124, 148, 2) Locker Room 03:42:49 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "how far" (126, 121, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:42:50 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "were you" (126, 116, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:43:00 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "thats" (119, 114, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:43:01 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "so" (116, 114, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:43:03 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "funyCode: Select all
03:48:03 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "LUCY what the fuck why did you kill me :(" (112, 166, 2) Brig 03:48:11 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "you took my machine and took it for yours" (107, 152, 2) Fore Primary Hallway 03:48:12 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "how dare you" (105, 145, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:48:14 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "I worked hard" (105, 145, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:48:17 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "on making that thingCode: Select all
03:48:57 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "FEATURE" (147, 138, 2) Starboard Primary Hallway 03:49:00 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "I called it" (147, 138, 2) Starboard Primary Hallway 03:49:02 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "its a feature guys" (147, 138, 2) Starboard Primary Hallway 03:49:46 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "Imagine beign a DDOSER putting money into laggign TG seervers" (127, 134, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:49:48 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "when all you need" (126, 137, 2) Central Primary Hallway 03:49:51 SAY Hoolny/(Seth Deces) (DEAD) "is a couple of igniters"
This is so toxically generalizing and wrong at the same time that its comical.iamgoofball wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 7:49 amyou and every single other admin who does this exact fuckin' pattern of behavior has the same two options:
1. say "ah yeah my bad, i was wrong, sorry"
2. quintuple down and never ever admit any form of fault whatsoever until it's far too late and has escalated to complaints/the entire community going "wtf"
every single time this happens at /tg/station, the admin picks 2
someday, an admin will pick 1 and be amazed how everyone immediately shuts the fuck up and stops caring because the admins demonstrated they aren't perfect and apologized for making a mistake
players will absolutely go hard on this because when we make mistakes, we have to draft a ban appeal and talk about how sorry we are to you, the admin banning us, and how we made a mistake and how we won't make that mistake again
when admins make mistakes, they get to deny the mistake happened, argue that there was no mistake, and then deny everything until headmins get involved and make an apology for them
it's simple as fuck, when you make a mistake and everyone calls you on it, just say "whoops, my bad, sorry" and then people will go away
don't append "ACTUALLY IT WAS JUSTIFIED BECAUSE X Y AND Z" that's how you end up looking like the admin who argued disposals is round removal
kieth4 wrote: infrequently shitting yourself is fine imo
There is a lot of very bizarre nonsense being talked on this forum. I shall now remain silent and logoff until my points are vindicated.
Player who complainted over being killed for looting cap office wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am Hey there, I'm Virescent, the super evil person who made the stupid appeal and didn't think it through enough. Just came here to say: screech, retards. Screech and writhe like the worms you are. Your pathetic little cries will keep echoing around for a while before quietting down. There is one great outcome from this: I rised up the blood pressure of some of you shitheads and lowered your lifespan. I'm honestly tempted to do this more often just to see you screech and writhe more, but that wouldn't be cool of me. So come on haters, show me some more of your high blood pressure please.
no because this is a peanut thread and i came up with that in all of five minutes to address a very niche point without any input from any of the other headmins, so to take it as precedent is folly. i don't know what happened to the phrase "act like a valid, get treated like a valid" went but it's still broadly applicable to the base terms of "Don't be a dick". it's like people hyperfixate on certain parts of the rules in ways that I haven't even thought about since 2019, or even as an admin administrating. i've seen people get gunned down in brig because they were being a shitter and they finally said "i'm telling the gods about this", at which point they were gunned down by everyone in the room since they had enough of their shit. i saw the whole thing unfold and immediately knew that no one who decided to kill the immersion-breaker should be punishedTearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 7:40 amThe unpopular opinion you're stating is objectively wrong in this case is: That a player should not take the rules into their own hands and round remove someone for breaking rule 1 precedent 4 without ahelping.
Is it fine, if in the future a similar situation happens this term, that I post this opinion of yours as precedent?
I see chemists setting chemistry on fire by accident all the time and not once have I seen an admin have the opinion that setting chemistry on fire, likely by accident, is justification for round removal. I believe, in this case, you are mistaken in believing that what toemas did was reasonable, especially because it was Seth's workplace as well.
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:41 am From my perspective, players just want to genuinely be listened to. And I don't mean it condescendingly, but to genuinely have their say and for admins to listen, process it and reply. Even if you don't give two shits about what the player is saying, even if you disagree with every part of what they say, players are less likely to leave an ahelp pissed off if you've listened to them and given a reply that directly addresses what they've told you.
Yeah go ruin some tryhard's atmos 30-minute setup as Engineer and tell me how it goes.Tearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:01 pmI see chemists setting chemistry on fire by accident all the time and not once have I seen an admin have the opinion that setting chemistry on fire, likely by accident, is justification for round removal. I believe, in this case, you are mistaken in believing that what toemas did was reasonable, especially because it was Seth's workplace as well.
Chances are I'd get ahelped. Because ahelping when someone ruins your 30 minute project is the normal thing to do, and should be encouraged.Agux909 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:17 pmYeah go ruin some tryhard's atmos 30-minute setup as Engineer and tell me how it goes.Tearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:01 pmI see chemists setting chemistry on fire by accident all the time and not once have I seen an admin have the opinion that setting chemistry on fire, likely by accident, is justification for round removal. I believe, in this case, you are mistaken in believing that what toemas did was reasonable, especially because it was Seth's workplace as well.
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:41 am From my perspective, players just want to genuinely be listened to. And I don't mean it condescendingly, but to genuinely have their say and for admins to listen, process it and reply. Even if you don't give two shits about what the player is saying, even if you disagree with every part of what they say, players are less likely to leave an ahelp pissed off if you've listened to them and given a reply that directly addresses what they've told you.
Not if the engi's setup consisted on spamming chat/lagging the round with no actual benefit to engineering. As was the case with Seth (by their own admission)Tearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:46 pmChances are I'd get ahelped. Because ahelping when someone ruins your 30 minute project is the normal thing to do, and should be encouraged.Agux909 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:17 pmYeah go ruin some tryhard's atmos 30-minute setup as Engineer and tell me how it goes.Tearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:01 pmI see chemists setting chemistry on fire by accident all the time and not once have I seen an admin have the opinion that setting chemistry on fire, likely by accident, is justification for round removal. I believe, in this case, you are mistaken in believing that what toemas did was reasonable, especially because it was Seth's workplace as well.
What's not normal is to stun cuff the person, hear that it's an accident, then throw them into a plasmafire without once considering that maybe ahelping would be a good idea.
And even then, if the person that ruins your 30 minute setup as engineer is another engineer who was also working on their own setup coincidentally near your setup I can't really see the justification in wordlessly round removing them.
Can you see where I'm coming from?
What Seth did was stupid, what Toemas did was also stupid. They both should have been punished, instead, neither was. Now both will go on to likely make the game less fun in the future, especially because this stupid behavior has been encouraged by the headmins.
If you can convince yourself that toemas did nothing wrong in this situation, there's no point in us arguing. Even Sans, the person I was arguing with, acknowledged that in his personal opinion toemas should have ahelped.Agux909 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:52 pmNot if the engi's setup consisted on spamming chat/lagging the round with no actual benefit to engineering. As was the case with Seth (by their own admission)Tearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:46 pm
Chances are I'd get ahelped. Because ahelping when someone ruins your 30 minute project is the normal thing to do, and should be encouraged.
What's not normal is to stun cuff the person, hear that it's an accident, then throw them into a plasmafire without once considering that maybe ahelping would be a good idea.
And even then, if the person that ruins your 30 minute setup as engineer is another engineer who was also working on their own setup coincidentally near your setup I can't really see the justification in wordlessly round removing them.
Can you see where I'm coming from?
What Seth did was stupid, what Toemas did was also stupid. They both should have been punished, instead, neither was. Now both will go on to likely make the game less fun in the future, especially because this stupid behavior has been encouraged by the headmins.
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:41 am From my perspective, players just want to genuinely be listened to. And I don't mean it condescendingly, but to genuinely have their say and for admins to listen, process it and reply. Even if you don't give two shits about what the player is saying, even if you disagree with every part of what they say, players are less likely to leave an ahelp pissed off if you've listened to them and given a reply that directly addresses what they've told you.
Literally this, two wrongs shouldn't make a right. If everyone is acting in bad faith everyone should get punished for it, not be justified because the other party was acting in bad faith too.
It might surprise you, but I don't personally agree with the way Thomas acted there (it's not something I'd personally do), he tends to have aggressive knee jerk reactions. That doesn't mean I think what he did was punishable. We can't expect the whole playerbase to act as we would act or as our definition of "the right way to act". He had justification to do what he did at the time he did it, and when you analize the whole situation, you can't deny it falls more under the reasonable, even if the action itself might not be of your liking.Tearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:55 pmIf you can convince yourself that toemas did nothing wrong in this situation, there's no point in us arguing. Even Sans, the person I was arguing with, acknowledged that in his personal opinion toemas should have ahelped.Agux909 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:52 pmNot if the engi's setup consisted on spamming chat/lagging the round with no actual benefit to engineering. As was the case with Seth (by their own admission)Tearling wrote: ↑Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:46 pm
Chances are I'd get ahelped. Because ahelping when someone ruins your 30 minute project is the normal thing to do, and should be encouraged.
What's not normal is to stun cuff the person, hear that it's an accident, then throw them into a plasmafire without once considering that maybe ahelping would be a good idea.
And even then, if the person that ruins your 30 minute setup as engineer is another engineer who was also working on their own setup coincidentally near your setup I can't really see the justification in wordlessly round removing them.
Can you see where I'm coming from?
What Seth did was stupid, what Toemas did was also stupid. They both should have been punished, instead, neither was. Now both will go on to likely make the game less fun in the future, especially because this stupid behavior has been encouraged by the headmins.
It is true that Thoman should have chosen admin intervention when he got hit with the fire axe, especially if he suspects metagrudging. However, what you should do is different from what you can do. Thoman was explicitly provoked by this player, their choice to escalate directly instead is sympathizable. Being angry isn't any excuse to break the rules, of course, so did Thoman poorly escalate?
I don't think so.
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