If we ban lowpop murderbone, we should also ban lowpop critical infrastructure sabotage.

[iamgoofball]

Just got out of a 12 person round where the traitor CE and Engineer worked together to blow up the SM, deconstruct the mix loop of Atmospherics to prevent air from being pumped, depowered the gravity generator, then proceeded to go around venting the entire station in multiple different locations while power ran out. They then tried to recall the shuttle, fortunately only once.

Can we make this equally bannable? It's lowpop murderbone but without the "everyone is dead" part, that's replaced with "everyone is suffocating and burning through air tanks while power is out and will never be back up".

[CMDR_Gungnir]

This just sounds like Murderbone but with extra steps. But also really hard to make a widesweeping policy on.

Critical Infrastructure Sabotage is normally FINE. But reaching that level can arguably be considered Murderboning as it's forcing people to confront you, which gives you the excuse to kill them.

It's hard to really make concrete policy, I imagine, without just flatly removing the ability to do that, which fucks over people who aren't going to THAT level. If you try, it just winds up being Really Subjective.

[wesoda25]

As someone who supported banning lowpop murderbone… meh. I’d say this already falls under admin discretion, personally I wouldn’t have noted or banned because this at least sounds more interesting than just hunting down 10 people and killing them. Being on a ravaged station and fighting to survive sounds a lot better than being hunted by a sweaty nerd that you likely have no chance against. Lowpop stations/servers shouldn’t become total safe spaces devoid of major antaggerry, just it’s worst faith/unhealthiest/most extreme forms (which I don’t think this falls under).

[Cobby]

What happens if they are obviously the bad guys so people try to stop them so they can play the game (no power is relatively debilitating on top of the obvious round rerolling effect) and they get killed? Why is that ok but not just straight up lowpop murderbone (outside of “because the rules say so”)?

In MRP this would (without additional context) be unacceptable per their kill policy, particularly the part where you’re setting yourself up to play for kills even though you fall into the acceptable categories of killing outside of your “job” as antag (what the rules call murderboning, idk if your definition is different)

[Pandarsenic]

This honestly sounds like it's mostly fine/already covered by the rules, as long as the admins are fine with spanking them for trying to recall

[Misdoubtful]

As someone who supported banning lowpop murderbone… meh. I’d say this already falls under admin discretion, personally I wouldn’t have noted or banned because this at least sounds more interesting than just hunting down 10 people and killing them. Being on a ravaged station and fighting to survive sounds a lot better than being hunted by a sweaty nerd that you likely have no chance against. Lowpop stations/servers shouldn’t become total safe spaces devoid of major antaggerry, just it’s worst faith/unhealthiest/most extreme forms (which I don’t think this falls under).

This tbh, leave it as a judgement call.

Doing antag things that make things interesting and making the round an inhospitable ball pit full of avocados are two different things.

Not about to throw that potential in the trash when it could actually be making things cool.

[chocolate_bickie]

Is this LRP or MRP you are referring to?

On LRP infrastructure is fixed by the crew because they have no limits on where and what they can do.

MRP has 'stay in your lane' preventing them from fixing the issues caused by antags. Maybe relax the 'stay in your lane' rules on low pop for Manuel instead?

[spookuni]

Is this LRP or MRP you are referring to?

On LRP infrastructure is fixed by the crew because they have no limits on where and what they can do.

MRP has 'stay in your lane' preventing them from fixing the issues caused by antags. Maybe relax the 'stay in your lane' rules on low pop for Manuel instead?

Just as a clarification - RPR 10, the roleplay rule governing staying in your lane, specifically grants leeway to stray out of your selected role / job if others are unable or not present to complete it themselves. (not unwilling though, that's it's own kettle of fish). In the event of low station pop causing critical roles to be unfilled, players are already fully allowed to take action themselves - you don't have to twiddle your thumbs while the SM burns if there are no engineers on the station to take care of it, or you know / have reasonable in character reason to suspect that the engineers are dead / incapable (in character, kidnapping or the like, not a lack of engineering experience, that's protected) of solving the problem.

[NamelessFairy]

Critical infrastructure sabotage provides interesting gameplay to most involved parties even on low population whereas murderbone does not, for that reason we are not interested in banning critical sabotage on lowpop.

Headmin Votes:
NamelessFairy: Agree
Dragomagol: Agree
RaveRadbury: Agree