Defecting in gangs

[Jacough]

This is something I've been wondering about as far as gangs and to a much lesser extent revs goes. When it comes to gangs, you've generally got that third gang that just gets utterly fucked, usually pretty early on. Like the gang may get a lieutenant and two or three actual gang members before the leaders get killed and the rest of the gang is left to rot. Suppose you're in that gang and you find yourself being one of the few surviving leaderless gang members. Would it be considered an IC issue to either turn yourself in to security or a larger gang to either get implanted or converted to a gang that actually has a shot at getting shit done?

The reason I mention revs as well because a while back I was implanted by the dwindling security team and was given a suicide mission to go down to cargo and try to get some implants, unarmed and beaten into orange health (HOS refused to give me a weapon and as far as health goes he just told me to get some shit from medical which was overrun by revs). Cut to the important part, a rev head and a few revs wander into cargo and find me trying to hide from them. Rather than outright kill me the rev head shows mercy and gives me an opportunity to get my implant removed so he can convert me, the other option of course being murdered. So I take him up on his offer and crazy enough he follows through with it.

Tl;dr: If we're backed into an inescapable corner as a loyalist or converted antag and we're given the opportunity to surrender and join the winning team are we allowed to take it or are we supposed to fight it out to the bitter end?

[Saegrimr]

The gang thing shouldn't be that big of a deal, especially leaderless you're really not gonna be able to do shit unless you really wanna lone wolf it and try to kill as many people as possible.

Getting loyalty implants removed is shit and usually bannable, but that's mostly for the people who just walk out of security and ask to have it removed. A situation like getting captured how you described is pretty cool RP, but outright asking for it will likely lead to trouble.

[TheColdTurtle]

But aren't they now supposed to be mind shield implants? So you don't really feel loyalty to nanotreason, but you just don't get brainwashed? But yeah just leaving sec and asking for the implant to be removed is a dick move.

[Cheimon]

But aren't they now supposed to be mind shield implants? So you don't really feel loyalty to nanotreason, but you just don't get brainwashed? But yeah just leaving sec and asking for the implant to be removed is a dick move.

The term "mind shield" is pretty open to interpretation. Only armour against conversion is one way to see it, but another is that it's shielding you from impure desires (like joining a cult).

After all "brain washing" can run from "will do whatever I say" to "cleaned of unpleasant thoughts". Given the way they work in the rules, mindshield implants are somewhere in the middle. I think it's reasonable to assume, policy wise, that a mindshield implant gives the user a strong desire to keep their implant in place.

[Slignerd]

In the end it doesn't really matter if your character feels loyalty or not. What matters is that the player shouldn't openly attempt to join conversion antags right after being implanted. Actively trying to remove an implant that protects you from conversion... that's pretty much self-antagging if you don't have a good reason for it, right?