Buff Traitor AI

[Scones]

No, not malf AI, traitor AI. It's pretty fucking rare on Sybil but antag status comes to everyone fairly often on lowpop badger, so I've played traitor AI my share of times.
And it's fucking awful. You have literally nothing. You are just a subverted AI - With all the weaknesses of a typical AI and no special strengths. No malf-esque powers, no nothing.

This is only so annoying because you have to kill somebody. Always. The objective is ALWAYS kill somebody (And yeah I know, what the fuck else would it be). And typically, once you kill one person, there is truly no hope of stealth - You have to go loud and take on the entire station. And that sucks. Because the AI gets styled on in retarded powergamey ways that someone ALWAYS deploys, including but not limited to:
- Shoving lockers to block your turrets
- Shoving girders to block turrets/COVER FLUID DISPENSERS SO YOU CAN'T OPEN THE INTERFACE
- Filling the entire core with a metal foam grenade, AKA instant victory because the AI has no way to clear said foam and you can just cut a path to victory while it's vision is obscured
- They broke a window and 2 r-walls and there was nothing you could do about it. Now they are pointing an emitter at the core (Box issue).

I understand that the AI is intensely powerful SOMETIMES, with plasma floods and shit, but I wouldn't mind traitor AIs getting some tools of subterfuge. Some version of overload machine, something that emags things so you can blame other shitty humans, all that.I understand that you could be super fucking professional in your killing and try to 'stealth kill' the target, but it's too difficult to do - You could mute him from comms, but the only way to kill him is either: Shock a door when he is almost dead, crush him in doors/shutters, or bolt and vent. All three of these options are loud as fuck and somebody will see them and INSTANTLY KNOW you are rogue, scream AI ROGUE KILL PLZZ and then the fucking lynch team comes to powergame your sat into the next fucking dimension.

Traitor AI is way too weak because of the standard weaknesses of the AI. Give it some selection of CPU tools that are unique to it and promote either misleading the crew with false information and dead ends, or reward the AIs who still want to go loud and murderbone the entire station.

This whole thing feels to me like it highlights stupid issues with the AI in the first place. Similarly, god fucking help you if the unresponsive APC bug occurs.

[Lo6a4evskiy]

(And yeah I know, what the fuck else would it be)

Prevent from escaping alive?

- Filling the entire core with a metal foam grenade, AKA instant victory because the AI has no way to clear said foam and you can just cut a path to victory while it's vision is obscured

That's pretty awesome, actually.

But yeah, you're pretty much required to have a cyborg.

What about deploying a syndiborg from ghosts?

[Steelpoint]

- Filling the entire core with a metal foam grenade, AKA instant victory because the AI has no way to clear said foam and you can just cut a path to victory while it's vision is obscured

That's actually really smart.

On topic, I do think Traitor AI's should get some CPU power to spend on Traitor AI abilities. I like Lo6's idea of letting the AI buy a borg that draws its user from the ghost pool. In addition a way to "reject" a Cyborgs personality (the player) will allow a AI to get rid of a incompetent/AFK/Whatever borg.

[Scones]

- Filling the entire core with a metal foam grenade, AKA instant victory because the AI has no way to clear said foam and you can just cut a path to victory while it's vision is obscured

That's pretty awesome, actually.

But yeah, you're pretty much required to have a cyborg.

What about deploying a syndiborg from ghosts?

Sounds awesome for the guy doing it, but think of the amount of work not being put into making that metal foam grenade. In fact, I think Atmos starts with a couple on some maps.

A syndiborg sounds insanely strong. Like, 20 TC this-is-it, HOWEVER it would be god-DAMNED hilarious if you ordered it around the 10 minute mark, have it kill your target and then claim Operatives are killing you
Free shuttle call. Nobody comes to check on you. Hilarity ensues.

Additional thought: Give traitor AIs a set of objectives:
- Trap X points worth of humans on the station
- Download __ R&D levels
- Kill __

Stuff like that. I'm hesitant to include 'prevent from escaping alive', though.

[Lo6a4evskiy]

It doesn't have to be a straight syndiborg, it could be a completely new cyborg module.

[Scones]

It doesn't have to be a straight syndiborg, it could be a completely new cyborg module.

My main concern was the fact it has near-endless lasers + emag

Hacking your borgs is not an option - However, I noticed I can turn off Safety on Beepsky
BUT not on Floorbots/Cleanbots. That's a cheap option that could make for some major hazards. Seriously, fuck emagged floorbots.

[Lo6a4evskiy]

What's wrong with emagged floorbots and cleanbots?

[cedarbridge]

It doesn't have to be a straight syndiborg, it could be a completely new cyborg module.

My main concern was the fact it has near-endless lasers + emag

Hacking your borgs is not an option - However, I noticed I can turn off Safety on Beepsky
BUT not on Floorbots/Cleanbots. That's a cheap option that could make for some major hazards. Seriously, fuck emagged floorbots.

Unless they'ed bugged, you should have control over all bots.

[Scones]

Bascally Beepsky can be pseudo-emagged by turning off his safeties
90% certain I am unable to do so on Cleanbots/Floorbots. I'll confirm this later.

[cedarbridge]

Bascally Beepsky can be pseudo-emagged by turning off his safeties
90% certain I am unable to do so on Cleanbots/Floorbots. I'll confirm this later.

The same should exist for the other bots as I've toggled them with both AI control and as a borg in the past.

[cedarbridge]

Bascally Beepsky can be pseudo-emagged by turning off his safeties
90% certain I am unable to do so on Cleanbots/Floorbots. I'll confirm this later.

The same should exist for the other bots as I've toggled them with both AI control and as a borg in the past.

[Lo6a4evskiy]

Yeah, you can always do that as AI.

[lumipharon]

The metal foam thing used to not work, because the turrets would shoot anything in their apc area, or something.
So turrets set to lethal would just balp through the foam to get to anyone that's in the room.

I believe it is now changed so they need LOS to activate, so yeah it works.


Also, honestly if a traitor AI knows tcomms scripts, and has atleast one borg, doing traitor objectives are laughably easy. If they don't know how to script, and/or don't have a borg, it becomes significantly harder.

[Phalanx300]

The biggest nerf personally was the removal of a large part of electrified stuff damage. You used to be able to instacrit people (if Sing was connected to main grid) which was a good way to stealthily dispose of someone. I remember Wintermote as the scariest AI though, he was extremely hard to kill and even went as far as creative killing. He once tried to kill me with overpressure, long and slow death

[lumipharon]

Me and several others were getting insta critted yesterday. I dunno why or how, considering (afaik) a single body part can't even take enoguh damage to crit you, and I only took chest damage, but was critted from 100% by a shocked door.

[cedarbridge]

Me and several others were getting insta critted yesterday. I dunno why or how, considering (afaik) a single body part can't even take enoguh damage to crit you, and I only took chest damage, but was critted from 100% by a shocked door.

afaik only extremities are damage capped (arms/legs.) If you somehow managed to shock your chest with a door you probably just got dunked.

[Gun Hog]

Bascally Beepsky can be pseudo-emagged by turning off his safeties
90% certain I am unable to do so on Cleanbots/Floorbots. I'll confirm this later.

Cleanbots and Floorbots are able to be hacked just as any other bots. If this is not the case for you, provide instructions on how to reproduce the problem.

[deathhoof]

Safety-disabled cleanbots are formidable. They are basically liquid dispensers that work all on their own.

[PKPenguin321]

Someone in ooc a million years ago suggested traitor AIs should be able to take control of augmented limbs. That'd be a fun, if situational, buff for traitor AIs.
"Quit hitting yourself, human."

[Whoisthere]

We could in theory give traitor AI a shitty drone or something that would be extremely obvious and generally awful but will allow it to manipulate shit to some degree for when there are no borgs around. The AI can either possess drone or have a ghost control it.

Or we could give traitor AI a bunch of lynch-mob-forming powers like, I don't know:

- photoshop photo! Take a photo of your target and photoshop a ling armblade onto it! Then send it to all newcasters! Yay!
- fake suit sensors! Just type name and suit sensors data of a fake/real crewman and behold - fake data is fed to all crew monitoring computers, overwriting real one! You can then either synthesize said crewmembers yells "Help Urist is ling eh killing me" over comms or kill him with pressure while his sensors show he's alive, well and in a totally different part of the ship!
- pretend you're subverted! Provoke crew into carding you, but what's that - you can fake laws that show up when you are carded! Type in the number of the law you want to fake and its text, now you can overwrite your "0. Complete your objectives at all costs" with "0. Only Urist is human"!
- MULE hack! You can now assume direct control over a MULE and drive over your target without waiting for cargo techs to cut the needed wires!
- Doar/electronics haxz! You can now emag, as an AI! Frame people! "Emag" cargo ordering console and order a bunch of spec ops crates, then make sure security knows about it! Once they perma the QM, emag him out of perma and look the other way while sec executes him!
- holopad hax! Turn holopads intro stroboscopes that induce seizures, retardation and tourettes!
- singularity attraction! By hacking an APC you can cause it to run a current through its wires that forms a magnetic field that acts as a singularity beacon!
- teleporter hax! Reprogram the telepoter so it gives people that use it random mutations!
- slipsword! Your core grows arms that are holding eswords and legs wearing galoshes AND you leave a wet trail wherever you go! You can't drop eswords or galoshes or interact with anything, but you CAN slip and sword people in maint like a giant robotic snail or something!

[Snakebutt]

- slipsword! Your core grows arms that are holding eswords and legs wearing galoshes AND you leave a wet trail wherever you go! You can't drop eswords or galoshes or interact with anything, but you CAN slip and sword people in maint like a giant robotic snail or something!

I think I'm stupider for having read this suggestion. Let's do it.


On a serious note, traitor AI is hard if you're alone, but laughably easy if you have a borg. Just have the borg space someone, or leave them on solars.

[DemonFiren]

Someone in ooc a million years ago suggested traitor AIs should be able to take control of augmented limbs. That'd be a fun, if situational, buff for traitor AIs.
"Quit hitting yourself, human."

Cue "I never asked for this." or "My self-harm is augmented."

[Reimoo]

We could in theory give traitor AI a shitty drone or something that would be extremely obvious and generally awful but will allow it to manipulate shit to some degree for when there are no borgs around. The AI can either possess drone or have a ghost control it.

Or we could give traitor AI a bunch of lynch-mob-forming powers like, I don't know:

- photoshop photo! Take a photo of your target and photoshop a ling armblade onto it! Then send it to all newcasters! Yay!
- fake suit sensors! Just type name and suit sensors data of a fake/real crewman and behold - fake data is fed to all crew monitoring computers, overwriting real one! You can then either synthesize said crewmembers yells "Help Urist is ling eh killing me" over comms or kill him with pressure while his sensors show he's alive, well and in a totally different part of the ship!
- pretend you're subverted! Provoke crew into carding you, but what's that - you can fake laws that show up when you are carded! Type in the number of the law you want to fake and its text, now you can overwrite your "0. Complete your objectives at all costs" with "0. Only Urist is human"!
- MULE hack! You can now assume direct control over a MULE and drive over your target without waiting for cargo techs to cut the needed wires!
- Doar/electronics haxz! You can now emag, as an AI! Frame people! "Emag" cargo ordering console and order a bunch of spec ops crates, then make sure security knows about it! Once they perma the QM, emag him out of perma and look the other way while sec executes him!
- holopad hax! Turn holopads intro stroboscopes that induce seizures, retardation and tourettes!
- singularity attraction! By hacking an APC you can cause it to run a current through its wires that forms a magnetic field that acts as a singularity beacon!
- teleporter hax! Reprogram the telepoter so it gives people that use it random mutations!
- slipsword! Your core grows arms that are holding eswords and legs wearing galoshes AND you leave a wet trail wherever you go! You can't drop eswords or galoshes or interact with anything, but you CAN slip and sword people in maint like a giant robotic snail or something!

Most of these are completely ridiculous. I love it.

[lumipharon]

It's pretty funny to have a telebeacon in space, and when someone tries teleport to your satellite (any anywhere for that matter) you change the destination to space at the last moment and comm mute them.

[mrpain]

Arent these "law 0" AI's able to hack their borgs through the RD console?

[Phalanx300]

Arent these "law 0" AI's able to hack their borgs through the RD console?

Only MALF AI's I believe. Maybe that should be changed.

[Saegrimr]

Arent these "law 0" AI's able to hack their borgs through the RD console?

Only MALF AI's I believe. Maybe that should be changed.

No i'm certain traitor AI can hack their borgs. I had a stun arm as an engiborg a couple days ago.

[Gun Hog]

Traitor and Malfunctioning AIs are able to hack their borgies and the Telecoms message console.

[Drynwyn]

The ability to hack your borgs is only really useful if you have several borgs- some options for traitor AI's that don't have many or any cyborgs would be nice.