Replacing the Disposals System

John_Oxford · Post by **John_Oxford** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:20 am #141983

Replacing Disposals Inlets (Where you put the trash) with trashcans, and removing the disposal pipes all around the station.

Replacing the inlets with trashcans, which have trashbags that can be taken out and replaced. Trashbags are replaced by the janitor who makes laps around the station going into departments to pick up trash. They don't have all access, and need to ask the AI/Department Staff to open the door.

One disposals unit is in the janitors office, which goes to the cargo disposal sorting thing, then from there, to the crusher/spacer combo thing.

The janitor starts with a box of trashbags, trashbags become tiny items with nothing in them, then scale with how many items are inside of them.

Overloading trashbags causes them to rip, dumping out the contents. Overloading is done by putting more items in once the bag has reached the large item category.

Pulling out a overloaded trashbag from a trashcan will rip the trashbag and dump the contents on the floor.

You can only overload a trashbag so much before it no longer accepts items.

Research can create boxes of nanofiber trashbags for extremely low research levels, and it only takes like 20 metal to make a box of the things, the research levels would be like mat 2 or something.

Research can also create boxes of bluespace trashbags, which are infinite and never need to be replaced, but once the item is in, it vanishes forever (to prevent client crashing from 9999 items) Bluespace trashbags would have relatively high research levels and require silver to create.

The pussywagon has a trashbag dispenser that can be loaded with up to 50 trashbags, clicking on the pussywagon will dispense one, the order in which you place them in is remembered (ie: you put in both nanofiber trashbags and normal trashbags)

The janitor starts with a shelf in his office now, which holds all the cleaning supplies (similar to how the janitor cart works, you can see all the items on it and what not) 3 boxes of 50 trashbags, 3 cleaning grenades, 1 spray bottle and one refill bottle (one you can't spray from, but contains 300 units of space cleaner) 6 wet floor signs, the holographic projector for wet floor signs, the mop, 2 bars of soap that are wrapped up and keys to the pussywagon a box of bear traps, and two boxes of mouse traps.

Also, new traitor item exclusive to the janitor, called the trashcan bomb. Disguised as a normal trashbag (or nanofiber/bluespace if you click it, it will change its type.) this acts as 2 syndicate minibombs when detonated, simply place into a trashcan and close the lid, the next person to open the trashcan will detonate the bomb, gibbing them. Costs 9 TC.

Leaving full trashbags laying around will spawn swarms of flies, which after idling on the trashbag for long enough, will start swarming humans, doing no damage, but giving a 30% chance to cause a random disease, and a 50% chance to drop a item in hand (from swatting) This should make a empahsis on why you would need to dispose of trash.

Pest-b-gone will kill fly swarms, but others will spawn soon after, spraying trashbags before hand will increase the time it takes for a swarm to manifest.

Hitting a trashbag with any sort of weapon (stun baton, cleaver, knife, esword, dual esword, claymore) will destroy it, leaving pieces of trashbag and trash on the floor and surrounding tiles.

Holding a trashbag in hand and dragging it to your other hand will rip it, leaving a ripped trashbag and trash on the same tile as you.

Ripped trashbags and trashbag pieces are completely useless, and constitute themseleves as trash.

A crate of 6 boxes of trashbags can be ordered from cargo for 10 points
A crate of 3 trashcans can be ordered from cargo for 20 points

Trashcans can't be wrenched down, and move freely by dragging.

You can construct a trashcan frame for 20 metal, wrenching it, then placing 10 metal on it will give you a trashcan. (Its much cheaper to order from cargo)

Trashcans can be shot over, can be shot to be destroyed into 20 metal on the ground. (Sometimes 17-23)

Trashcans are not bomb proof, can be destroyed by bombs, explosives, acid, or anything else.

If you hit a trashcan with a weapon, it will become damaged, and you will not be able to place trashbags in it, pull the current trashbag out, or close/open the lid. If the trashbag in it was a trashbag bomb, this will detonate the bomb.

You can welder undamaged trashcans to get 10 metal from the trashcan, which will then turn into a trashcan frame, wrenching the frame will disassemble it and you will get 20 metal in return.

You can also welder damaged trashcans, which will completely destroy them in return for 15 metal.

Will sprite if support is given. (Which even if it did, its not like anyones going to code these long drawn out ideas i make, so i'm starting to think spriting them before anyone even agrees to code them is pointless)

TechnoAlchemist · Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:40 am

Disposals is iconic, fun, and adds a lot of depth to the game.

I'd be okay with trashcans in some public areas, but doing away with disposals entirely is a terrible idea.

ShadowDimentio · Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:11 am

TechnoAlchemist wrote:Disposals is iconic, fun, and adds a lot of depth to the game.

I'd be okay with trashcans in some public areas, but doing away with disposals entirely is a terrible idea.

Trashcans already exist, and are rarely used because ~HIGH TECH SPACE STATION~

Also were you high off bath salts when you wrote this? Since when do we want to remove features and replace them with shitty gimmicks?

Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:13 am

what is with all the shitty ideas lately

1g88a · Post by **1g88a** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:19 am #141997

PKPenguin321 wrote:what is with all the shitty ideas lately

Nukeop flamethrower mech is a cool idea

ShadowDimentio · Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:19 am

There must be a gas leak in here or something because we keep getting retarded ideas brought back. Footprints, space wind, removing malf, new cult, fusion, removing changeling... It's awful.

Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:22 am

1g88a wrote:
PKPenguin321 wrote:what is with all the shitty ideas lately
Nukeop flamethrower mech is a cool idea

hey man, i'm not the one calling names here

John_Oxford · Post by **John_Oxford** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:40 am #142007

ShadowDimentio wrote:
TechnoAlchemist wrote:shitty gimmicks?

>tfw type out 100 sentence explanation going indepth into the science and understanding of trash down to the very atomic particles that make up the universe that involves trash

>gimmick

I fucking love this station.

DemonFiren · Post by **DemonFiren** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 6:26 am #142019

Keep posting, John, you make my day.

ThanatosRa · Post by **ThanatosRa** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 6:35 am #142024

The disposals system is part of what makes /tg/station what it is.

Incomptinence · Tue Dec 22, 2015 7:34 am

Disposals are superior to mules really.

LiamLime · Post by **LiamLime** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:47 am #142036

As a system, it's a very badly made, fairly buggy and computationally difficult system, which fails at everything it's meant to do - it fails at being able to take out the trash due to being very clunky and slow to use, it fails at disposing of bodies because it takes them to a nearly publicly accessible area, it fails at facilitating escapes, it fails at facilitating movement of people around the station (such as breaking into or out of restricted areas), it fails at delivering things (good god is mail awful).

I also really don't care much for 'iconic', because that's inherently a temporary state. What was iconic 2 years ago is not iconic anymore today.

I think that replacing the station-wide disposal system with trash cans and a much simpler dumb waiter delivery system, makes a lot of sense. Basically trash cans being more or less simple container items the janitor is expected to maintain, giving him an excuse to enter areas that are off limits to him usually, with possibly some sort of time limited more-access card, which gives him temporary access to areas of the station in time intervals - for example giving him access to engineering for 10 minutes, then medbay for the next 10 minutes, etc.

As for the dumb waiter, it'd be a very basic system which allows its users to move items from dumb waiter to dumb waiter. Nothing more or less than that. No cargo involved, no dumb mail system, no buggy disposal system, etc.

I don't think disposal pipes as a system should be removed though. I think they should remain constructable, and I agree that there should still be pipes in some areas.

leibniz · Post by **leibniz** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:59 am #142037

Disposal is fun. "Trashbag revolution" is stupid.

1g88a · Post by **1g88a** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:12 am #142038

In fact, add more pipe systems! An inter-department mail system! When pigs fly and dismemberment is added, you can mail the HoS' head to the brig!

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:13 am #142039

I mailed the janitor his trash bag he accidentally disposalled earlier today, so the mail system does work if you know how to use it.

Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:23 am

i mail R&D my deposits as shaft miner all the time

Cheimon · Post by **Cheimon** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:56 am #142059

Okay, let's just go through some of the things that make this bad.

Nobody will ever be keen on letting the janitor in to move trash around. Why would I bother? He's just going to slip up the place. Also, players will think he might murder them.

Trash cans take 30 metal(!!!) to make. 30! A wall is, like, less than 5 pieces. Girders are just 2. I know what I'm disassembling next time I need to make a fortress, because fucking hell, that's a lot of materials. A ripley isn't more than 50 sheets. If I disassemble two trashcans, an r-wall, and a couple of windows, I can make a god-damn mech. That's how much metal these are made of.

Swarms of flies are causing random diseases! To everyone! The virologist can't keep up with that, and he won't. There aren't even that many diseases: if 30% of fly swarms cause a disease, and the station has 20 trash cans where someone's put, like, a cigarette butt in or a piece of paper or whatever, then the station has about 6 different diseases running around. You know how quick those spread? It's a shitshow. One of them is probably brainrot.

But don't worry, everyone in the crew will use that pest spray that's only in botany and the garden! No, they won't. And besides, why would we want everyone in the crew to have a refillable spray can? Slip memes are bad enough already.

There's this detailed construction thing for what is basically a box bolted to the floor. Seriously, just replace the word 'trashcan' with 'locker' and you've got pretty much the same thing, only this has contingencies for every damn situation.

You're removing a system that provides a fun and interesting escape from almost every room on the station.

You're removing the endless potential for disposals sabotage and disposal rides.

You're removing 90% of stuff from cargo disposals and the recycling crusher.

You're adding 50% more busywork to the janitor.

You can't shove a person in a trashbag or yourself hide inside one.

newfren · Post by **newfren** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:02 pm #142060

how are people not getting the joke

TheNightingale · Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:08 pm

We already have trashcans on Ministation - why not just use those?

Super Aggro Crag · Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:35 pm

This idea belongs in a garbage can

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:15 pm #142071

Ministation.

You're looking to play on Ministation. They use trash cans because the map lacks a crusher and disposal system.

Cik · Post by **Cik** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 2:40 pm #142084

if we had like 10 janitors this would begin to be possible

but we have like one or zero janitors so no they have too much work already keeping every surface from being coated in blood all the time.

Lumbermancer · Tue Dec 22, 2015 6:34 pm

I'm glad I'm not the one with the most horrible ideas here.

1g88a · Post by **1g88a** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 7:34 pm #142143

PKPenguin321 wrote:i mail R&D my deposits as shaft miner all the time

See? My ideas are so good that half the time they turn out to be already implemented

John_Oxford · Post by **John_Oxford** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:38 pm #142172

fuck your trashbags skid

ok ok ok.

you fucking hate trashbags that even mildly inconvience you from your hardcore disposals action.

my deep apologies for attempt to remove your precious disposals system, i'll make sure to add more shit next time to a station that already lags to all hell when something even mildly chaotic occurs.

EDIT:
the mild possiblity that i was high off my ass when i wrote this has nothing to do with how F-A-N-T-A-S-T-I-C of a idea it is.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 12:11 am #142201

Disposals shouldn't lag that much at all, it is very different from the other network systems such as power and atmos.

The only thing is that I think it should be easier to lay the pipes.

Removing either the welding or wrenching step would be a very nice chance that should make placing disposals systems more attractive.

TheNightingale · Wed Dec 23, 2015 12:16 am

Removing one of the steps means people can reverse disposals into the Captain's office faster than the HoP can get all-access and secure the ID.

Wed Dec 23, 2015 2:10 am

John_Oxford wrote:EDIT:
the mild possiblity that i was high off my ass when i wrote this has nothing to do with how F-A-N-T-A-S-T-I-C of a idea it is.

i fucking knew it

Post by **MMMiracles** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 2:13 am #142226

implement the idea so we can start it off by putting this thread in the trash.

LiamLime · Post by **LiamLime** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 3:03 am #142241

I honestly cannot fathom why anyone would care about the disposal system enough to think that the idea of replacing it with something simpler is fucking obviously a bad thing.

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

The disposals system cant be removed without major remapping.

Like, 50% of its purpose is an emergency escape route for when you have no access.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 11:34 am #142324

TheNightingale wrote:Removing one of the steps means people can reverse disposals into the Captain's office faster than the HoP can get all-access and secure the ID.

uhm you can do this with or without the extra step. Its just the long stretches of pipe that become a PITA.

Jacough · Post by **Jacough** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 1:43 am #142462

Not-Dorsidarf wrote:The disposals system cant be removed without major remapping.

Like, 50% of its purpose is an emergency escape route for when you have no access.

This kills tactical disposal bins.

callanrockslol · Thu Dec 24, 2015 7:52 am

LiamLime wrote:I honestly cannot fathom why anyone would care about the disposal system enough to think that the idea of replacing it with something simpler is fucking obviously a bad thing.

Its less fun, that is the most important thing. Bins are boring, disposals can be used to fuck around and actually do things.

ShadowDimentio · Thu Dec 24, 2015 8:09 am

John_Oxford wrote:EDIT:
the mild possiblity that i was high off my ass when i wrote this has nothing to do with how F-A-N-T-A-S-T-I-C of a idea it is.

I FUCKING KNEW IT

LiamLime wrote:I honestly cannot fathom why anyone would care about the disposal system enough to think that the idea of replacing it with something simpler is fucking obviously a bad thing.

What part of "we shouldn't be removing perfectly good features to replace with shitty gimmicks" doesn't make sense to you

LiamLime · Post by **LiamLime** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 9:02 am #142517

ShadowDimentio wrote:
LiamLime wrote:I honestly cannot fathom why anyone would care about the disposal system enough to think that the idea of replacing it with something simpler is fucking obviously a bad thing.
What part of "we shouldn't be removing perfectly good features to replace with shitty gimmicks" doesn't make sense to you

The "good features" part. Disposals are awful and replacing them with something that does item and mob transportation better would be a good step in my opinion. Notice that I said "something simpler", I didn't say trash cans. I'm confused by the knee jerkiness of the "do not change disposals, they are an important part of SS13" reaction to the very idea of replacing disposals, not about people disliking trash cans as the replacement.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 12:47 pm #142526

Like I said, placing disposals should be made easier.

Merging trunks with the bins/chutes on top would also make it less of a pain.

Thu Dec 24, 2015 10:39 pm

Disposals are also a gigantic pain to map. Ideally any replacement wouldn't be quite as hard.

Takeguru · Post by **Takeguru** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 3:30 am #142674

I dunno, replacing disposals seems like the wrong move.

I've seen plenty of traitorous acts enabled by them.

Earlier this month or the last a traitor managed 11 kills with an emagged grinder and rerouted disposals, don't change it

Incomptinence · Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:25 am

Disposals can be interrupted, trapped or redirected to trespass. Trashbags bring anal retentive bag tearing mechanics and then just feed into a single disposals point for the janitor anyway then go through the rest of the "flawed" disposals system to the crusher anyway.

Fri Dec 25, 2015 9:34 pm

Takeguru wrote:I dunno, replacing disposals seems like the wrong move.

I've seen plenty of traitorous acts enabled by them.

Earlier this month or the last a traitor managed 11 kills with an emagged grinder and rerouted disposals, don't change it

yeah this was probably me
rerouting disposals to do lethal traitory things is one of my favorite traitor gimmicks

Anonmare · Post by **Anonmare** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:13 pm #142792

Meme answer:-

Spoiler:

None meme answer:-
No, because it's fun and let's you do fun things for fun.

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:53 pm #142798

fuck bluespace