Abusing lives

[D&B]

Imagine for a moment you enter the syndicate base/golem ship/ et all and in one way or another you engage them in battle. You're a normal station crewmember, more likely than not a miner, and you manage to beat the creature you engaged at first. You're then presented with a sheer red army tactic of unending fresh bodies, possessed by the same person that you killed before, wordlessly running up to your exact location and trying to kill you, even if they had no way of knowing why the fight started or where you are.

How does the administration deal with this issue? Is such blatant abuse of easily producible lives for vengeance allowed?

[Ayy Lemoh]

How does the administration deal with this issue? Is such blatant abuse of easily producible lives for vengeance allowed?

Punished for metagaming. There may be a possible exception however I can't think of one besides spawncamping.

[SpaceInaba]

wow what a hard thread

[oranges]

also repukan you better not be ban evading

[D&B]

I'm not

[imblyings]

The practical answer is admins dont care nor do players most of the time. No one will ever enforce ashliggers going to the place of their dead body to return it to the tendril or golems doing the same to retrieve lost gear. Admins would also have a hard time caring about protecting a miner player who wants to rules lawyer with metagaming rules so they can kill golems, vault podpeople at leisure while they're forced to be naive regarding the murderous miner.

Deal with it. The only time this happens for miners is if there are ashliggers, every other time it happens its because mining decided to find some conflict with roles that were friendly or neutral, or sealed off by lava.

[Grazyn]

in one way or another you engage them in battle.

There is metagaming and there is making players miserable while you abuse their forced ignorance. Example:
Miner walks into #ghostrole base and wordlessly starts slaughtering them like he is allowed to. #Ghostrole respawns but he's not allowed to know the miner is hostile because MMUH ARRPEE and depending on the #ghostrole he is also not allowed to initiate hostilities so he peacefully approaches the miner just to be slaughtered again until all the respawns are expended or destroyed by the miner. So much fun

[CPTANT]

in one way or another you engage them in battle.

There is metagaming and there is making players miserable while you abuse their forced ignorance. Example:
Miner walks into #ghostrole base and wordlessly starts slaughtering them like he is allowed to. #Ghostrole respawns but he's not allowed to know the miner is hostile because MMUH ARRPEE and depending on the #ghostrole he is also not allowed to initiate hostilities so he peacefully approaches the miner just to be slaughtered again until all the respawns are expended or destroyed by the miner. So much fun

I don't think you should respawn as the same ghostrole in the first place.....

[Grazyn]

in one way or another you engage them in battle.

There is metagaming and there is making players miserable while you abuse their forced ignorance. Example:
Miner walks into #ghostrole base and wordlessly starts slaughtering them like he is allowed to. #Ghostrole respawns but he's not allowed to know the miner is hostile because MMUH ARRPEE and depending on the #ghostrole he is also not allowed to initiate hostilities so he peacefully approaches the miner just to be slaughtered again until all the respawns are expended or destroyed by the miner. So much fun

I don't think you should respawn as the same ghostrole in the first place.....

This is not enforced in the rules and in the code neither, I think we're gonna need a headmin to clarify this. Does this only work if I'm killed by another player? What if I die from other causes, am I not allowed to respawn as the same ghostrole?

[imblyings]

Lol no one would ever enforce that, it'd have to be a code thing. There would be no point at all to ashlizards if it were, no point in golems making different mineral bodies etc

[Nabski]

If it's ash lizards I don't see an issue with them respawning to defend the hive. Same with syndicate base.

Golems or pod people gotta suck it up and die, as they have no reason to come to the call of their dying brothers to defend the hive or be awoken by the automated security alarm.

[imblyings]

*every reason to

lavaland magic aint gotta explain shit

[Nabski]

I meant that there was less of a thing for pod people or golems to fuck about and get revenge.

Remember, fighting your own faction over an IC thing then respawning is a good way to get dunkedghost banned.

Fighting someone on station, taking a ghost role and going after that person is also a good way to get dunkedghost banned.

[Shadowflame909]

Ew. Ghost roles shouldn't get a free pass on meta grudge and metagame. There is a way to enforce it. "Admin is this guy the same ckey? I think he's metagrudging me with ghost roles" "WHY YES HE IS" Bwoink Ban. Easy. I feel the same way about people metagaming the xeno ruin to spawn a alien larva. Yet the response to that is as well, if they don't get the larva metagaming it is a-ok.

TBH the rules on ghost roles should be harder. Why do they allow admins to be so lax on them? They're dead and should have the least amount of interaction with the station possible. Ghost roles exist for them to have something to do, not to be free antag validS mc shitter. Right?

[Armhulen]

ghosts should be banned from respawning from the same source, or maybe just a cooldown

[Nabski]

Ew. Ghost roles shouldn't get a free pass on meta grudge and metagame. There is a way to enforce it. "Admin is this guy the same ckey? I think he's metagrudging me with ghost roles" "WHY YES HE IS" Bwoink Ban. Easy. I feel the same way about people metagaming the xeno ruin to spawn a alien larva. Yet the response to that is as well, if they don't get the larva metagaming it is a-ok.

TBH the rules on ghost roles should be harder. Why do they allow admins to be so lax on them? They're dead and should have the least amount of interaction with the station possible. Ghost roles exist for them to have something to do, not to be free antag validS mc shitter. Right?

You're seeing that from a player perspective. In reality ghost role bans are applied longer and harder than any other bans.

[imblyings]

I meant that there was less of a thing for pod people or golems to fuck about and get revenge.

Remember, fighting your own faction over an IC thing then respawning is a good way to get dunkedghost banned.

Fighting someone on station, taking a ghost role and going after that person is also a good way to get dunkedghost banned.

That's understandable, I was more talking about grazyns point, where it is seems extremely unfair to force a state of ignorance on lavaland roles so miners can slaughter them.

[CitrusGender]

If you're going out of your way to constantly attack people with ghost-roles: that's metagruding and metagaming plain and simple. If you happen to be in their base and they throw an unrelenting fury of bodies at you to get you out of their base, I would say they should refrain from doing so since their only knowledge of you being there was gained from a previous life (a little more leeway would be given to ash-lizards than golems due to this inherent hostility.) If you believe this is happening to you: I would advise you to ahelp. It's not very actionable but if you get the suspicion more than once: feel free to ahelp and that person may get a note.

It may be a coding issue as well but we deal with what we have. A ghost-role timer would be preferable in this circumstance (but doesn't exist at the moment as far as I'm aware.)