From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Forum rules
Only Certified™ Players™ may post in here.
If you are not able to post in here, you are not a Certified™ Player™. Play on a mainline /tg/ game server to gain posting powers in this forum. (certified gamers are only calculated once per day)
Only Certified™ Players™ may post in here.
If you are not able to post in here, you are not a Certified™ Player™. Play on a mainline /tg/ game server to gain posting powers in this forum. (certified gamers are only calculated once per day)
- The Wrench
- Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:06 am
- Byond Username: The Wrench
From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/ ... omment-box
I don’t like this PR
I don’t like this PR
Jonathan Gupta wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 6:32 pm all you godamn do is whine and complain come up with ideas, stop bitching for christs sake.
- Fikou
- In-Game Game Master
- Joined: Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:38 am
- Byond Username: Fikou
- Github Username: Fikou
- Location: Dreamland
- Jacquerel
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 8:10 pm
- Byond Username: Becquerel
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I am reticent about losing the ability to just hit rocks while dodging monsters but we'll see if there's an answer about that
- Capsandi
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 10:59 pm
- Byond Username: Capsandi
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I do, tho i think its passing up the opportunity to fix mining's biggest problem which is that the act of mining is decentralized on a massive z level and so theres no hope in hell of catching a miner doing their job. Though maybe, in a follow up pr the vein spawning area would be shrunk to surround the mining station somewhat. That way if i had to steal some crap from a miner i could do so just by doing a quick loop around the station and beating them until horizontal instead of hoping they have a gps with their name instead of endlessly chasing after COMO1 after COMO1.
Lower your tone with me if your tracked play time doesn't look like this:Timonk wrote:You have clearly never seen his dickWesoda25 wrote:Genuinely think they should be blacklisted.
Flatulent wrote:of course you can change religion doing it while islamic however makes you lose your head from happiness
-
- Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2022 8:54 pm
- Byond Username: LEDDriver
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Oh yes i can't wait for crystallizer and gold/uranium solidification botany to become meta because this is obviously a brilliant idea;
Surely it will make things better.add: Added ore vents. Scanning them with mining scanners shows what minerals they contain. Scan again to fight off a horde of beasts so the ore vent will produce mineral boulders!
-
- Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:18 pm
- Byond Username: AccountName5
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
It would be really cool if engineers would start building sentries or whatever as a coordination to assist miners. Engineer gaming!
Would be a little sad for rock smashing to go. I wanted to add rocket launchers for clarke to dig ore.
Would be a little sad for rock smashing to go. I wanted to add rocket launchers for clarke to dig ore.
- dirk_mcblade
- Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:54 am
- Byond Username: Dirk_McBlade
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Atmos can make diamonds?
- Jacquerel
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 8:10 pm
- Byond Username: Becquerel
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
As a side note I believe (if im remembering rigjt) that if the rest of Arcane's economy tweaks go through it includes removing the lathe tax
- The Wrench
- Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:06 am
- Byond Username: The Wrench
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I’m very skeptical of the idea that scarcity is a good thing or something we want to happen on shifts. Not being able to do your job because someone else didn’t do their job is shitty. At the very least make it so we can order all the materials in cargo so engineers don’t have to suffer because we don’t have the materials.
Jonathan Gupta wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 6:32 pm all you godamn do is whine and complain come up with ideas, stop bitching for christs sake.
- Capsandi
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 10:59 pm
- Byond Username: Capsandi
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
every1 is so fukken entitled to evarything now a days, back in my day there was no ore silo. I had to beat noob cargo techs on route to sci for just a few sheets of plasma. Then I got my shit kicked in by security who actually put players in the timeout box instead of this catch & release bullshit wherein they just check you for valids
Lower your tone with me if your tracked play time doesn't look like this:Timonk wrote:You have clearly never seen his dickWesoda25 wrote:Genuinely think they should be blacklisted.
Flatulent wrote:of course you can change religion doing it while islamic however makes you lose your head from happiness
-
- Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2022 8:54 pm
- Byond Username: LEDDriver
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Yes shiftstart too with a simple burn can on meta/ice, since they have a prebuilt crystallizer.
- warbluke
- Joined: Mon May 29, 2017 2:36 pm
- Byond Username: Warbluke
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Holy shit this is going to make robo even more ass to play when there's no miners.
At this point I think I'll just go steal the silver from medbay surgery beds every time I play lowpop robo. And the crystals from the teleporter, and the gold from the vault.
At this point I think I'll just go steal the silver from medbay surgery beds every time I play lowpop robo. And the crystals from the teleporter, and the gold from the vault.
- datorangebottle
- Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:53 am
- Byond Username: Datorangebottle
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I'm so conflicted.
I like the idea of DRG mining gameplay.
I also like the comfy rock smashing gameplay that /tg/ has been steadily moving away from.
I also think the boulder refining looks clunky and slow as hell, especially when multiple miners are trying to use it.
I also dislike the idea of needing to upgrade mining equipment; typically that means it just won't get done.
I like the idea of DRG mining gameplay.
I also like the comfy rock smashing gameplay that /tg/ has been steadily moving away from.
I also think the boulder refining looks clunky and slow as hell, especially when multiple miners are trying to use it.
I also dislike the idea of needing to upgrade mining equipment; typically that means it just won't get done.
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Jul 07, 2023 9:16 pm I highly doubt any other admin on the team would have given you this chance, except maybe Kieth because his brain worms are almost as bad as mine.
Vekter wrote: ↑Tue May 16, 2023 4:45 pm At what point does someone's refusal or failure to improve become malice in and of itself? If you give someone a year to stop shitting on the carpet and they keep doing it but get slightly closer to the bathroom every time and sometimes they get to the toilet before it happens, at what point does it become acceptable to just ask them to go shit in someone else's house?
Timberpoes wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 7:00 pm I'm sorry, can we get a real player to resolve this appeal? I don't like this trial player. They can't even set their own name.
sinfulbliss wrote: ↑I almost prefer Rave's AI-generated "We cannot accept this appeal at this time. If you would like assistance appealing in the future, please dial 1-800-1984-1488."
Pandarsenic wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 2:25 pm I think we can all agree that someone throwing a reverse revolver at Zyb as a secret test of character, and Zyb immediately fucking himself with it, is the best thing we all could have received for Christmas this year
- RedBaronFlyer
- Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:41 am
- Byond Username: RedBaronFlyer
- Location: SS13, Manuel Division, Cargo Bay
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Already see some issues that I’m going to list because I’m too lazy to write paragraphs.
- miners are going to be even harder to recover then they are already. I swear some miners run as deep into lava land and die just to watch a conga line of mediborgs and paramedics run through and obstacle course of hostile mobs to get their bodies.
- non-miners mining is going to suck more
- cargo is probably going to get bitched at even more for not spending 70% of their budget mass shipping in iron, glass, and plastic for roboticists to waste on EORG prep.
- miners are going to be even harder to recover then they are already. I swear some miners run as deep into lava land and die just to watch a conga line of mediborgs and paramedics run through and obstacle course of hostile mobs to get their bodies.
- non-miners mining is going to suck more
- cargo is probably going to get bitched at even more for not spending 70% of their budget mass shipping in iron, glass, and plastic for roboticists to waste on EORG prep.
WARNING, Prolonged exposure to my opinions can be mentally scarring or in some cases, FATAL
Stamper of papers, pusher of crates, and the cleaner of floors.
I'm Eugine Adrian Hynes on Manuel, I'm very uncool.
Stamper of papers, pusher of crates, and the cleaner of floors.
I'm Eugine Adrian Hynes on Manuel, I'm very uncool.
Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Fri Mar 03, 2023 5:11 pm I assume he did it elsewhere because it's fucking goofball and he never half-asses his shitty ideas, he full asses them so both cheeks are absolutely slathered in shit
- Arcanemusic
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Tue May 03, 2016 6:17 am
- Byond Username: ArcaneMusic
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
It's clear there's a large number of things that have gone un-addressed in this rework this far (albeit there are a few that are and people just didn't read the PR that carefully).Re: Tremendous amount of feedback.
Is it because I am a rat bastard man? Is it because I am evil and fucked up and want to ruin mining because miners were sitting back and having TOO EASY of a time in my 2d space sandbox? Is this my revenge for that time that we closed making coal and ore and I've been seething ever since at the chance to get vengeance?
Nah it's that mining is fucking huge and there's a lot of good feedback hitting things I just didn't think about yet. I know some people aren't sold on this yet, and all I ask is people have an open mind. Hell, there's still a good chance it gets closed because headcoders want to take the department into a different direction. Who knows! We'll find out.
Thanks for the outpouring of feedback gang, positive and negative. I'll see about getting some lists together and figuring out what's feasible or not with the original design direction or if I fucked up and the mineral economy is fucked forever
- Chocodemon
- Joined: Sun May 21, 2017 1:52 am
- Byond Username: Chocodemon
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
is it not possible to have both types of mining?
-
- Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:08 pm
- Byond Username: MooCow12
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I already steal the bs crystals from the command`s teleporters.
As long as any job can do the prospecting and defense of the ore sites then its completely fine. (In other words, a plasmaman engie who doesnt have access to lethal weapons should still be able to get ore somehow)
Public mining is sometimes the only thing that prevents a station from being entirely unable to get matts and softlocked on everything without anyone being able to do anything reasonable about it at all (well xenobio can help but by the time that happens shuttle will be called and round will be over)
List of my favorite TG Staff.
Spoiler:
- CMDR_Gungnir
- Joined: Tue May 04, 2021 11:11 am
- Byond Username: CMDR Gungnir
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
"Sorry Robotics, you can't do your job because we didn't find those vents/someone else decided to use all the silver and gold."The Wrench wrote: ↑Thu Aug 31, 2023 6:50 pm I’m very skeptical of the idea that scarcity is a good thing or something we want to happen on shifts. Not being able to do your job because someone else didn’t do their job is shitty. At the very least make it so we can order all the materials in cargo so engineers don’t have to suffer because we don’t have the materials.
"Sorry (other job), you can't do your job because Robotics decided to build 6 gygaxes and print 30 posibrains."
Scarcity is fucking stupid because there's no way to actually stop someone from doing something. There's literally no way to ration things, you just have to hope that other people aren't going to be cunts (spoiler: they're going to be cunts)
- The Wrench
- Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:06 am
- Byond Username: The Wrench
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I completely agree. I’m glad that arcane is being such a class act about this. It’s refreshing to see a maintainer not throw a temper tantrum when their work isn’t praised.
Jonathan Gupta wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 6:32 pm all you godamn do is whine and complain come up with ideas, stop bitching for christs sake.
- dirk_mcblade
- Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:54 am
- Byond Username: Dirk_McBlade
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
What about the gulag
- Scriptis
- In-Game Admin
- Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:05 am
- Byond Username: Scriptis
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
love u arcane don't let the goobers goob all over you
i believe in industry(tm) expansion(tm)
don't forget to add departmental ore budgets
- Capsandi
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 10:59 pm
- Byond Username: Capsandi
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Thats why in the past we had a whole department dedicated to supplying other departments with materials. The ore silo is incompatible with material scarcity. A lack of material scarcity is incompatible with the past XX years of "just put it in the protolathe lol" design. Take ur pick.CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Thu Aug 31, 2023 11:39 pm Scarcity is fucking stupid because there's no way to actually stop someone from doing something. There's literally no way to ration things, you just have to hope that other people aren't going to be cunts (spoiler: they're going to be cunts)
Lower your tone with me if your tracked play time doesn't look like this:Timonk wrote:You have clearly never seen his dickWesoda25 wrote:Genuinely think they should be blacklisted.
Flatulent wrote:of course you can change religion doing it while islamic however makes you lose your head from happiness
- warbluke
- Joined: Mon May 29, 2017 2:36 pm
- Byond Username: Warbluke
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I'd be up for removing the ore silo, or even just adding departmental silos. I miss the days of dragging a mats crate back to robo from the ORM.Capsandi wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:14 am Thats why in the past we had a whole department dedicated to supplying other departments with materials. The ore silo is incompatible with material scarcity. A lack of material scarcity is incompatible with the past XX years of "just put it in the protolathe lol" design. Take ur pick.
- dirk_mcblade
- Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:54 am
- Byond Username: Dirk_McBlade
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
We have a machine that teleports resources into every protolathe but we still need pipes to move gas. Hm.
-
- Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:08 pm
- Byond Username: MooCow12
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Material scarcity should be the work of antags who are smart enough to realize that they have their own unique abstract resource pool to scale into the round with (tc/knowledge/etc) and can safely deny the crew their own scaling.
If an antag wants resource scarcity all they have to do is walk to a single silo connected device and siphon all of the materials from it then throw it into space, ive done it before its not hard.
The only reason this strategy isnt viable is because it just....gets shuttle called because people rightfully do not want to play when all of their job content is suddenly unobtainable and they have nothing to do.
If an antag wants resource scarcity all they have to do is walk to a single silo connected device and siphon all of the materials from it then throw it into space, ive done it before its not hard.
The only reason this strategy isnt viable is because it just....gets shuttle called because people rightfully do not want to play when all of their job content is suddenly unobtainable and they have nothing to do.
List of my favorite TG Staff.
Spoiler:
- c4g
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 4:11 pm
- Byond Username: C4g
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
we have a bluespace gas network for the gas vendors nobody uses, but maybe theres issues scaling it up or somethingdirk_mcblade wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:47 am We have a machine that teleports resources into every protolathe but we still need pipes to move gas. Hm.
- CMDR_Gungnir
- Joined: Tue May 04, 2021 11:11 am
- Byond Username: CMDR Gungnir
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
The problem is it just kinda doesn't work too well with the modern way of the game, I imagine. Things are a lot faster these days that people just wouldn't tolerate that.Capsandi wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:14 amThats why in the past we had a whole department dedicated to supplying other departments with materials. The ore silo is incompatible with material scarcity. A lack of material scarcity is incompatible with the past XX years of "just put it in the protolathe lol" design. Take ur pick.CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Thu Aug 31, 2023 11:39 pm Scarcity is fucking stupid because there's no way to actually stop someone from doing something. There's literally no way to ration things, you just have to hope that other people aren't going to be cunts (spoiler: they're going to be cunts)
Which is why I'm really afraid of this mining change. I really don't think it's a good idea, and people'll just get fed up with never having any materials and stop playing because they can't do anything.
- conrad
- Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:57 am
- Byond Username: Conrad Thunderbunch
- Location: 𝑀𝑜𝒾𝓈𝓉
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
This is an excellent chance to buff out mining outcome so miners can have their minigames and single player experiences and the station can maybe not run out of everything every round.
Win-win.
Win-win.
I normally go by Ricky. Tell me how'd I do here. ⋆ 𝒯𝒶𝓀𝒾𝓃𝑔 𝒶 𝓈𝒶𝒷𝒶𝓉𝒾𝒸𝒶𝓁. ⋆
And now a word from our sponsors:
And now a word from our sponsors:
Armhulen wrote: ↑Thu Nov 30, 2023 11:08 pmThe Spessmen Times wrote:Prohibition agent Sam Salamander bragged that he could find a metacord in any server in under 30 minutes. In Bagil it took him 21 minutes. In Sybil 17 minutes, and Manuel just 11 minutes. But Terry set the record of 35 seconds. Sam asked an assistant on the arrivals shuttle where to get a discord invite, and the assistant linked him one.
RedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2024 3:52 pmIt would somehow manage to pick Birdshot Station for headmin if we did that
- EmpressMaia
- Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2022 8:22 pm
- Byond Username: EmpressMaia
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Turrets can only hold energy weapons and fauna dont take much laser damage
- zergking
- Joined: Tue May 09, 2023 7:52 am
- Byond Username: Zergking
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
But what about the Ashies?
-
- Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2023 5:19 am
- Byond Username: GPeckman
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I'd have to double check but I'm 90% sure PKAs are considered energy weapons too.EmpressMaia wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:04 pmTurrets can only hold energy weapons and fauna dont take much laser damage
-
- Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:02 pm
- Byond Username: Chocolate_bickie
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
People won't stop playing, they didn't after cobby chem, they didn't after combat mode.CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 6:16 amThe problem is it just kinda doesn't work too well with the modern way of the game, I imagine. Things are a lot faster these days that people just wouldn't tolerate that.Capsandi wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:14 amThats why in the past we had a whole department dedicated to supplying other departments with materials. The ore silo is incompatible with material scarcity. A lack of material scarcity is incompatible with the past XX years of "just put it in the protolathe lol" design. Take ur pick.CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Thu Aug 31, 2023 11:39 pm Scarcity is fucking stupid because there's no way to actually stop someone from doing something. There's literally no way to ration things, you just have to hope that other people aren't going to be cunts (spoiler: they're going to be cunts)
Which is why I'm really afraid of this mining change. I really don't think it's a good idea, and people'll just get fed up with never having any materials and stop playing because they can't do anything.
This will push more players away from material intensive jobs though, since few people want to engage with the sweaty powergaming to actually do their job.
Much like cobby chem all the dirty fucking casuals will be bullied out of their role until they build a spreadsheet with the optimal timing and setup required to do their job before the hour mark.
Exactly like chemistry atm.
- dendydoom
- In-Game Head Admin
- Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:40 am
- Byond Username: Dendydoom
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
it's almost like the people making the code and designing the mechanics are totally detached from the people running the rounds and dictating rules around gameplay and roleplay
MrStonedOne wrote:I always read dendy's walls of text
NSFW:
-
- Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:18 pm
- Byond Username: AccountName5
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
I was thinkign about implementing a new sentry gun, like a pneumatic cannon sentry engineers could build to launch anything they want at fauna.EmpressMaia wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:04 pmTurrets can only hold energy weapons and fauna dont take much laser damage
-
- Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:02 pm
- Byond Username: Chocolate_bickie
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Sorry, I feel like I dunked on cobby chem alot in my last comment and I want to clarify this is a more general issue.
Alot of the games systems have been given more complexity, often with the goal of breaking some gameplay loop the coding team dislikes.
Complexity is good, but there needs to be an entry point for each job, so that players can learn mechanics without getting dunked on by mechanics only explained on the wiki/github.
For this pr for example I would suggest that the entry point be normal mining tools can be used on these veins, but instead of spawning a wave upon succesful extraction they spawn maybe 1-3 random mobs.
This builds the expectation in new players minds that mining = incoming fight. It would also act as 'training' for waves, helping you learn about different mobs attack patterns. Finally it would provide a 'safer' method for ashwalkers/golems/crew to mine that is still not risk free.
tldr; wyci
Alot of the games systems have been given more complexity, often with the goal of breaking some gameplay loop the coding team dislikes.
Complexity is good, but there needs to be an entry point for each job, so that players can learn mechanics without getting dunked on by mechanics only explained on the wiki/github.
For this pr for example I would suggest that the entry point be normal mining tools can be used on these veins, but instead of spawning a wave upon succesful extraction they spawn maybe 1-3 random mobs.
This builds the expectation in new players minds that mining = incoming fight. It would also act as 'training' for waves, helping you learn about different mobs attack patterns. Finally it would provide a 'safer' method for ashwalkers/golems/crew to mine that is still not risk free.
tldr; wyci
- Jacquerel
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 8:10 pm
- Byond Username: Becquerel
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
why did you mention "combat mode" in a post about making the game more complex
-
- Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:02 pm
- Byond Username: Chocolate_bickie
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Combat mode was used as an example for Gungnir after they said this game change would stop people from playing SS13. My point was that previous large-scale changes to mechanics and departments have always been called out as the death of TG, but never are.
I then went into my rant about complexity.
-
- Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:08 pm
- Byond Username: MooCow12
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Depth and complexity are welcoming but deleting the skill floor and not rewarding some level of success from doing the bare minimum is harsh
A friend of mine tried to play the game a couple months ago and told me they ended up quitting because they couldnt make anything as a newbie chemist
Its why i think ghost roles need more love, at the very least we should give new players somewhere with training wheels to practice learning stuff along with some hand holding that the wiki doesnt provide
the chaos of the game also impacts peoples ability to aquire skills and knowledge that last alot longer than a single round
A friend of mine tried to play the game a couple months ago and told me they ended up quitting because they couldnt make anything as a newbie chemist
Its why i think ghost roles need more love, at the very least we should give new players somewhere with training wheels to practice learning stuff along with some hand holding that the wiki doesnt provide
the chaos of the game also impacts peoples ability to aquire skills and knowledge that last alot longer than a single round
List of my favorite TG Staff.
Spoiler:
- RedBaronFlyer
- Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2022 2:41 am
- Byond Username: RedBaronFlyer
- Location: SS13, Manuel Division, Cargo Bay
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Doesn’t help that there’s no basic test map on the TG code base, if I want to try something in an isolated environment I either have to set up the SM every time or speed run whatever I was going to do before the power dies. (By the way this punishes new engineers a shitload since the power dies even faster in multiplayer.)MooCow12 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 2:54 pm Depth and complexity are welcoming but deleting the skill floor and not rewarding some level of success from doing the bare minimum is harsh
A friend of mine tried to play the game a couple months ago and told me they ended up quitting because they couldnt make anything as a newbie chemist
Its why i think ghost roles need more love, at the very least we should give new players somewhere with training wheels to practice learning stuff along with some hand holding that the wiki doesnt provide
the chaos of the game also impacts peoples ability to aquire skills and knowledge that last alot longer than a single round
WARNING, Prolonged exposure to my opinions can be mentally scarring or in some cases, FATAL
Stamper of papers, pusher of crates, and the cleaner of floors.
I'm Eugine Adrian Hynes on Manuel, I'm very uncool.
Stamper of papers, pusher of crates, and the cleaner of floors.
I'm Eugine Adrian Hynes on Manuel, I'm very uncool.
Super Aggro Crag wrote: ↑Fri Mar 03, 2023 5:11 pm I assume he did it elsewhere because it's fucking goofball and he never half-asses his shitty ideas, he full asses them so both cheeks are absolutely slathered in shit
- Kendrickorium
- Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:00 am
- Byond Username: Kendrickorium
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
i feel like if i started mining right now, i would really like this
i feel like if i had been a miner for the past few years i wouldnt like this
neat change, nice job arcane
i feel like if i had been a miner for the past few years i wouldnt like this
neat change, nice job arcane
- Jacquerel
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 8:10 pm
- Byond Username: Becquerel
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
There absolutely is a basic test map it's called RuntimestationRedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 4:11 pm Doesn’t help that there’s no basic test map on the TG code base, if I want to try something in an isolated environment I either have to set up the SM every time or speed run whatever I was going to do before the power dies. (By the way this punishes new engineers a shitload since the power dies even faster in multiplayer.)
Doesn't have an SM though.
-
- Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:18 pm
- Byond Username: AccountName5
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
It has RTGs that generate enough power for runtime station. You can also varedit one of them if you need more power for whatever reason.Jacquerel wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 4:27 pmThere absolutely is a basic test map it's called RuntimestationRedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 4:11 pm Doesn’t help that there’s no basic test map on the TG code base, if I want to try something in an isolated environment I either have to set up the SM every time or speed run whatever I was going to do before the power dies. (By the way this punishes new engineers a shitload since the power dies even faster in multiplayer.)
Doesn't have an SM though.
- Jacquerel
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 8:10 pm
- Byond Username: Becquerel
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
Oh yeah I only mentioned because you might want to fuck with the SM on a solo instance, but generally you don't and it bypasses that entirely by having essentially infinite power.
- Cobby
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:19 pm
- Byond Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobby
- Github Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobblestone
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
can we ban gay chat like im about to start being homophobic and i like dudes.
Voted best trap in /tg/ 2014-current
- Capsandi
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 10:59 pm
- Byond Username: Capsandi
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
When you see rainbow chat you think gay chat, but when i see rainbow chat I think back to the future year 2007 in which the common solution to making anything on the web more epic was the rainbow gradient.
Lower your tone with me if your tracked play time doesn't look like this:Timonk wrote:You have clearly never seen his dickWesoda25 wrote:Genuinely think they should be blacklisted.
Flatulent wrote:of course you can change religion doing it while islamic however makes you lose your head from happiness
-
- Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:08 pm
- Byond Username: MooCow12
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
For a long long time the rainbow was a Christian symbol about how god would never flood the world again and in the span of a decade that was replaced with the idea of men fucking
List of my favorite TG Staff.
Spoiler:
- Jacquerel
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 8:10 pm
- Byond Username: Becquerel
- CMDR_Gungnir
- Joined: Tue May 04, 2021 11:11 am
- Byond Username: CMDR Gungnir
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
You misunderstand.chocolate_bickie wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 1:57 pmPeople won't stop playing, they didn't after cobby chem, they didn't after combat mode.CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 6:16 amThe problem is it just kinda doesn't work too well with the modern way of the game, I imagine. Things are a lot faster these days that people just wouldn't tolerate that.Capsandi wrote: ↑Fri Sep 01, 2023 12:14 amThats why in the past we had a whole department dedicated to supplying other departments with materials. The ore silo is incompatible with material scarcity. A lack of material scarcity is incompatible with the past XX years of "just put it in the protolathe lol" design. Take ur pick.CMDR_Gungnir wrote: ↑Thu Aug 31, 2023 11:39 pm Scarcity is fucking stupid because there's no way to actually stop someone from doing something. There's literally no way to ration things, you just have to hope that other people aren't going to be cunts (spoiler: they're going to be cunts)
Which is why I'm really afraid of this mining change. I really don't think it's a good idea, and people'll just get fed up with never having any materials and stop playing because they can't do anything.
This will push more players away from material intensive jobs though, since few people want to engage with the sweaty powergaming to actually do their job.
Much like cobby chem all the dirty fucking casuals will be bullied out of their role until they build a spreadsheet with the optimal timing and setup required to do their job before the hour mark.
Exactly like chemistry atm.
People are going to quit because they want to play the game and do their job but they can't because """scarcity""" and oops all of the metal was wasted already before they got the chance to do something! Antags can creaty scarcity in-round by pulling all the metal into sheets and throwing it into space.
Do you know what happens? The shuttle is called because nobody wants to deal with it. Now imagine that's EVERY round. Nobody wants to deal with it, and it's the natural state, so they stop playing.
It's very different from cobbychem because that was a single job that you could still do things in, it just slowed you down (using buffers and low heats) until you got the spreadsheet.
And I don't know what combat mode has to do with "cannot do anything".
- Jacquerel
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 8:10 pm
- Byond Username: Becquerel
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
i think that if we dont want there to sometimes not be a thing, on a normal round, or else we believe that the round is unplayable then we shouldnt have an economy based on that thing
and i refer here to both materials and credits
and i refer here to both materials and credits
- Cobby
- Code Maintainer
- Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:19 pm
- Byond Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobby
- Github Username: ExcessiveUseOfCobblestone
Re: From the creator of the lathe tax- Rock and no ores torture (Codenut)
let me know when you'd like my rent I assume im way behind since i didnt even know i was using this space until your post. If youd like to have a productive conversation about medical/chem im happy to indulge, but harboring this amount of disdain for a feature years after is a bit much.
Not sure how cobbychem "bullied casuals out of their role", chem has always been a very wiki intensive job. Changing the chem effects or what have you doesnt touch that problem. Now Fermichem certainly progresses that issue where you need to know both the recipe AND ideal pH, but im not sure how cobbychem did that anymore than trekchems or goofchems.
This might be true in the sense that people who played heavily in say 2015 or even the timeframe of 2018ish want to recreate the experience they fell in love with which becomes much harder to do when new players come in with a different expectation or personal enjoyment of the game. Especially true when people come from say a murderbone video or a sseth video where the gamey parts are highlighted instead of the more immersive rp-centric style people i'd argue used to be accustomed to, so to curb that you have to make mechanical changes that curb the behavior (such as nerfs or downsides to originally powerful aspects of the game). SUPER Especially true is that the community is big enough now where you the individual dont have to care about how you behave towards other players in the game because the community isnt as tightknitted/small as it used to be, so theres no love lost if you abuse a feature and consequently little love lost if someone ends up patching it despite it being a classic.
Also obligatory you are able to contribute to the game in ways you think it would be improved. It may require selling but thats no different than wanting to push a policy change.
Not sure how cobbychem "bullied casuals out of their role", chem has always been a very wiki intensive job. Changing the chem effects or what have you doesnt touch that problem. Now Fermichem certainly progresses that issue where you need to know both the recipe AND ideal pH, but im not sure how cobbychem did that anymore than trekchems or goofchems.
its no different than players thinking admins are putting their hands in the cookie jar when they shouldnt be.
This might be true in the sense that people who played heavily in say 2015 or even the timeframe of 2018ish want to recreate the experience they fell in love with which becomes much harder to do when new players come in with a different expectation or personal enjoyment of the game. Especially true when people come from say a murderbone video or a sseth video where the gamey parts are highlighted instead of the more immersive rp-centric style people i'd argue used to be accustomed to, so to curb that you have to make mechanical changes that curb the behavior (such as nerfs or downsides to originally powerful aspects of the game). SUPER Especially true is that the community is big enough now where you the individual dont have to care about how you behave towards other players in the game because the community isnt as tightknitted/small as it used to be, so theres no love lost if you abuse a feature and consequently little love lost if someone ends up patching it despite it being a classic.
Also obligatory you are able to contribute to the game in ways you think it would be improved. It may require selling but thats no different than wanting to push a policy change.
Voted best trap in /tg/ 2014-current
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: BonChoi, DeathHasForm, kidgenius, NecromancerAnne, xzero314